Durham investigation (Update: Sussman acquitted) (3 Viewers)

SaintForLife · Aug 14, 2020

It looks like the first shoe has dropped with the Durham investigation with the Clinesmith plea deal. Clinesmith wasn't a low level FBI employee involved in the Crossfire Hurricane investigation.

He worked with Strzok to arrange sending an FBI agent into Trump-Flynn briefing, was on the Mueller team, he took part in the Papadopoulos interviews, and he participated in the FISA process.

From the NYT article:

Ex-F.B.I. Lawyer Expected to Plead Guilty in Review of Russia Inquiry (Published 2020)

Prosecutors did not reveal any evidence of the kind of broad anti-Trump conspiracy among law enforcement officials that the president has long alleged.

www.nytimes.com

I wonder who else knew about the lies?

bdb13 · Jul 1, 2023

SaintForLife said:
I knew you would post some partisan source instead of even just a news article that talked about what the Durham report found.

Durham failed in holding the people responsible for the Trump Russia collusion narrative, but he did expose the scheme. Hillary created the Trump Russia collusion narrative with Fusion GPS & Christopher Steele. Long time Clinton Operative Charles Dolan was a source of the discredited Steele Dossier. Brennan briefed Obama on Hillary plan to link Trump with colluding with Russia to help him win the election.

I'll post the receipts whenever Twitter is back to normal.

I am reading that Brennan was relaying a Russian intelligence analysis to Obama when he talked about the plan for Hillary to "stir up" the Russia-Trump collusion thing. I've only started really looking into everything here since you've posted and that was the first thing I looked at but I think that's a pretty relevant detail.

bdb13 · Jul 1, 2023

SaintForLife said:
I knew you would post some partisan source instead of even just a news article that talked about what the Durham report found.

Durham failed in holding the people responsible for the Trump Russia collusion narrative, but he did expose the scheme. Hillary created the Trump Russia collusion narrative with Fusion GPS & Christopher Steele. Long time Clinton Operative Charles Dolan was a source of the discredited Steele Dossier. Brennan briefed Obama on Hillary plan to link Trump with colluding with Russia to help him win the election.

I'll post the receipts whenever Twitter is back to normal.

Also, I don't believe it's in dispute that the FBI launched its investigation after the Papadopoulos thing and not when they came into possession of the Steele document. And I believe Durham admitted during the hearing that it wasn't in dispute that the Russians hacked the DNC.

If I'm correct on both of those (and leaving out a few other things probably that I can't think of off the top of my head) you already have some basis for an appearance of possible collusion sans anything to do with Hillary.

Booker · Jul 1, 2023

bdb13 said:
Also, I don't believe it's in dispute that the FBI launched its investigation after the Papadopoulos thing and not when they came into possession of the Steele document. And I believe Durham admitted during the hearing that it wasn't in dispute that the Russians hacked the DNC.

If I'm correct on both of those (and leaving out a few other things probably that I can't think of off the top of my head) you already have some basis for an appearance of possible collusion sans anything to do with Hillary.

Not to mention Eric Trump reportedly having said they get “all the funding they need out of Russia,” Junior’s meeting with Russian operatives about getting dirt on Hillary, Roger Stone seeming to have prior knowledge of when Russian leaks were going to be made, numerous proven points of contact between Russians and the Trump campaign (that they would deny until confirming evidence was provided), the ten or so instances of obstruction of justice discussed in the Mueller report…

bdb13 · Jul 1, 2023

Booker said:
Not to mention Eric Trump reportedly having said they get “all the funding they need out of Russia,” Junior’s meeting with Russian operatives about getting dirt on Hillary, Roger Stone seeming to have prior knowledge of when Russian leaks were going to be made, numerous proven points of contact between Russians and the Trump campaign (that they would deny until confirming evidence was provided), the ten or so instances of obstruction of justice discussed in the Mueller report…

Yeah.. didn't remember the Eric Trump comment but remember the "dirt on Hillary" email and meeting and the Roger Stone stuff.

FullMonte · Jul 1, 2023

SaintForLife said:
Brennan briefed Obama on Hillary plan to link Trump with colluding with Russia to help him win the election.

and?

So, Brennan briefed the president that a political candidate was going to try and dirty up their opponent. Let's say, for argument's sake, that the whole GOP talking point here is correct, and Hillary was completely aware that Trump had done nothing improper or illegal regarding contacts with Russia, and was 100% fabricating the whole thing.

So what? What is it that you think the president should have done upon being briefed that a political candidate was going to lie about their opponent to make them look like a corrupt candidate?

bdb13 · Jul 1, 2023

FullMonte said:
and?

So, Brennan briefed the president that a political candidate was going to try and dirty up their opponent. Let's say, for argument's sake, that the whole GOP talking point here is correct, and Hillary was completely aware that Trump had done nothing improper or illegal regarding contacts with Russia, and was 100% fabricating the whole thing.

So what? What is it that you think the president should have done upon being briefed that a political candidate was going to lie about their opponent to make them look like a corrupt candidate?

I think if there was information presented to the President which was ascertained or suspected of being true by our intelligence which said a candidate/campaign was suspected of feeding false information to the FBI on an opponent then it would probably be something worth investigating.. though not sure how usual it would be for the President to make the call.

Not sure that's what was presented to Obama.

FullMonte · Jul 2, 2023

bdb13 said:
I think if there was information presented to the President which was ascertained or suspected of being true by our intelligence which said a candidate/campaign was suspected of feeding false information to the FBI on an opponent then it would probably be something worth investigating.. though not sure how usual it would be for the President to make the call.

Not sure that's what was presented to Obama.

But, that's not the claim. The claim was that Brennan briefed Obama on a " Hillary plan to link Trump with colluding with Russia to help him win the election." I didn't see anything about Brennan briefing Obama that Hillary was going to the FBI with false information. If Brennan had information that Hillary was going to knowingly provide the FBI with false information, shouldn't that be something he was bringing to the FBI, and not directly to the president?

I'm trying to wrap my head around what it is that the right is alleging happened with this briefing, and what it is that they think Obama should have done.

What I've found is that Brennan's notes about that meeting were declassified and release (although redacted somewhat), and the relevant portion is his notes that he talked about "alleged approved by Hillary Clinton a proposal from one of her foreign policy advisers to vilify Donald Trump by stirring up a scandal claiming interference by the Russian security service..." That sounds like he was telling Obama that Hillary was going to try and make Trump look corrupt. Nothing in those notes appears to imply (or state) that Brennan was saying that she was going to give the FBI information.

bdb13 · Jul 2, 2023

FullMonte said:
But, that's not the claim. The claim was that Brennan briefed Obama on a " Hillary plan to link Trump with colluding with Russia to help him win the election." I didn't see anything about Brennan briefing Obama that Hillary was going to the FBI with false information. If Brennan had information that Hillary was going to knowingly provide the FBI with false information, shouldn't that be something he was bringing to the FBI, and not directly to the president?

I'm trying to wrap my head around what it is that the right is alleging happened with this briefing, and what it is that they think Obama should have done.

What I've found is that Brennan's notes about that meeting were declassified and release (although redacted somewhat), and the relevant portion is his notes that he talked about "alleged approved by Hillary Clinton a proposal from one of her foreign policy advisers to vilify Donald Trump by stirring up a scandal claiming interference by the Russian security service..." That sounds like he was telling Obama that Hillary was going to try and make Trump look corrupt. Nothing in those notes appears to imply (or state) that Brennan was saying that she was going to give the FBI information.

I agree, I read it the same way.

Snarky Sack · Jul 2, 2023

FullMonte said:
But, that's not the claim. The claim was that Brennan briefed Obama on a " Hillary plan to link Trump with colluding with Russia to help him win the election." I didn't see anything about Brennan briefing Obama that Hillary was going to the FBI with false information. If Brennan had information that Hillary was going to knowingly provide the FBI with false information, shouldn't that be something he was bringing to the FBI, and not directly to the president?

I think that is a good question. Why did Brennan think that Obama needed to know about the Clinton disinformation plan, especially in light of your next question?

I think the fair assumption is that since Clinton did go to the FBI, then going to the FBI was part of the plan. If going to the FBI was part of the plan, Brennan would have learned that when he heard about the plan.

Therefore, there would have been no reason to leave that part out, since that is what would have the relevance to the president.

Admittedly, that is a triple assumption, but what else could Clinton have planned to do with her disinformation? If she published it, the FBI would get involved anyway.

FullMonte said:
I'm trying to wrap my head around what it is that the right is alleging happened with this briefing, and what it is that they think Obama should have done.

For one thing, as soon as the Russian collusion, and Steele Dossier was leaked, Obama could have told the press that he had been briefed that Clinton would try to manufacture a scandal that sounds exactly like the Steel Dossier.

He could have also advised Clinton against the plan, if he thought that it was inappropriate. I think the right is taking his hearing about the plan and doing nothing to stop it as approval.

FullMonte said:
What I've found is that Brennan's notes about that meeting were declassified and release (although redacted somewhat), and the relevant portion is his notes that he talked about "alleged approved by Hillary Clinton a proposal from one of her foreign policy advisers to vilify Donald Trump by stirring up a scandal claiming interference by the Russian security service..." That sounds like he was telling Obama that Hillary was going to try and make Trump look corrupt. Nothing in those notes appears to imply (or state) that Brennan was saying that she was going to give the FBI information.

I'm not sure that this is the relevant point. But maybe another poster thought it was and that is what you are responding to.

What I don't get about the Clinton disinformation scheme in relation to current events is how willing people are to forget how the FBI was so corrupt in running with the disinformation, whether they knew it originated with Clinton or not. They lied to get warrants, spoke on official devices ni the most profane language possible about stopping Trump from being elected, and vilified Trump supporters in the vilest terms possible.

But . . . we're supposed to just assume that they have cleaned up their act, and are just these honest seekers of truth now.

Also, no one on the left seems at all upset that Clinton did what she did and that it put the country through what it did.

MT15 · Jul 2, 2023

Well, Trump was and is corrupt, and his campaign did communicate and cooperate with Russia, so where is the “disinformation”?

It also seems to me that you are in favor of political dirty tricks when they suit your favored candidate. You eagerly post nonsense from the Hunter Biden narrative that came from Roger Stone, Rudy Giuliani and Steve Bannon, correct?

How is that any different?

SaintForLife · Jul 3, 2023

1/12 Australian diplomats confirm: Papadopoulos never mentioned direct contact with Russians nor any offer of assistance to Crossfire Hurricane investigators.
2/12: No info from Intelligence Community corroborated the hypothesis that launched the Crossfire Hurricane investigation.
3/12: Exculpatory evidence from Carter Page, George Papadopoulos, & Trump's Senior Foreign Policy Advisor largely overlooked by the FBI.
4/12: Investigative leads conflicting with FBI's theory of the case, such as Page's denial of connection to Manafort, were not pursued.
5/12: FBI declined Carter Page's offer for an interview about allegations in Yahoo News article, instead sought FISA surveillance.
6/12: FBI relied on unvetted, uncorroborated Steele reporting for FISA applications, despite recognized conflicts with his primary sub-source, Danchenko.
7/12: Crossfire Hurricane investigators never questioned Steele about his info in Yahoo News article accusing Carter Page of collusion.
8/12: Not a single allegation in the Steele dossier was corroborated by investigators during or after Crossfire Hurricane.
9/12: Counterespionage issues surrounding Steele's primary sub-source, Danchenko, were never examined by the FBI.
10/12: FBI leadership largely disregarded the Clinton Plan intelligence received at the same time as the Australian Paragraph Five information.
11/12: Information about Charles Dolan, a Democratic operative with ties to Russia, was essentially ignored by Crossfire Hurricane investigators.
12/12: Crossfire Hurricane investigators shared only partial info with Department attorneys on Page FISA applications, withholding potentially doubt-casting details.

Snarky Sack · Jul 3, 2023

MT15 said:
Well, Trump was and is corrupt, and his campaign did communicate and cooperate with Russia, so where is the “disinformation”?

It also seems to me that you are in favor of political dirty tricks when they suit your favored candidate. You eagerly post nonsense from the Hunter Biden narrative that came from Roger Stone, Rudy Giuliani and Steve Bannon, correct?

How is that any different?

Those may or may not be good points.

But in fairness to FullMonte, I'll allow him to respond, and make them if he likes.

bdb13 · Jul 3, 2023

SaintForLife said:
1/12 Australian diplomats confirm: Papadopoulos never mentioned direct contact with Russians nor any offer of assistance to Crossfire Hurricane investigators.
2/12: No info from Intelligence Community corroborated the hypothesis that launched the Crossfire Hurricane investigation.
3/12: Exculpatory evidence from Carter Page, George Papadopoulos, & Trump's Senior Foreign Policy Advisor largely overlooked by the FBI.
4/12: Investigative leads conflicting with FBI's theory of the case, such as Page's denial of connection to Manafort, were not pursued.
5/12: FBI declined Carter Page's offer for an interview about allegations in Yahoo News article, instead sought FISA surveillance.
6/12: FBI relied on unvetted, uncorroborated Steele reporting for FISA applications, despite recognized conflicts with his primary sub-source, Danchenko.
7/12: Crossfire Hurricane investigators never questioned Steele about his info in Yahoo News article accusing Carter Page of collusion.
8/12: Not a single allegation in the Steele dossier was corroborated by investigators during or after Crossfire Hurricane.
9/12: Counterespionage issues surrounding Steele's primary sub-source, Danchenko, were never examined by the FBI.
10/12: FBI leadership largely disregarded the Clinton Plan intelligence received at the same time as the Australian Paragraph Five information.
11/12: Information about Charles Dolan, a Democratic operative with ties to Russia, was essentially ignored by Crossfire Hurricane investigators.
12/12: Crossfire Hurricane investigators shared only partial info with Department attorneys on Page FISA applications, withholding potentially doubt-casting details.

[Papadopoulos] also suggested the Trump team had received some kind of suggestion from Russia that it could assist this process with the anonymous release of information during the campaign that would be damaging to Mrs Clinton (and President Obama). (Emphasis added.)

The Shoddy Russia Investigation | National Review

John Durham’s report exposes how the FBI orchestrated one of the dirtiest political tricks in American history on the thinnest of grounds.

www.nationalreview.com

And again, I believe Durham said during the hearing that it was not it dispute that the Russians hacked the DNC.

SaintForLife · Jul 3, 2023

bdb13 said:
The Shoddy Russia Investigation | National Review
John Durham’s report exposes how the FBI orchestrated one of the dirtiest political tricks in American history on the thinnest of grounds.
www.nationalreview.com

And again, I believe Durham said during the hearing that it was not it dispute that the Russians hacked the DNC.

The Russia probe’s predicating incident – word from Australian diplomat Alexander Downer that Trump volunteer George Papadopoulos may have been offered Russian assistance – was, according to Durham, not only insufficient but embellished. The Australian tip did “not include any mention of the hacking of the DNC, the Russians being in possession of emails, or the public release of any emails,” Durham notes. Downer likewise recounted that Papadopoulos “made no mention of Clinton emails, dirt or any specific approach by the Russian government to the Trump campaign team with an offer or suggestion of providing assistance.”

Durham exposes FBI role in Clinton's Trump-Russia deception

The FBI's Trump-Russia probe was not only baseless, but influenced by an unprecedented Clinton campaign scam.

mate.substack.com

Screenshot_20230703_173650_Acrobat for Samsung.jpg

One of the FBI agents I'm London said the Papadopoulos predicate was "thin" and FBI agent Strzok said "there's nothing to this, but we have to run it to ground.

I don't think Durham investigated the DNC hack. There are some questions about it considering the DNC refused to let the FBI have access to the servers. Also, Crowdstrike CEO said in congressional testimony that they had no evidence of any data being exfiltrated.

Snarky Sack · Jul 3, 2023

SaintForLife said:
The Russia probe’s predicating incident – word from Australian diplomat Alexander Downer that Trump volunteer George Papadopoulos may have been offered Russian assistance – was, according to Durham, not only insufficient but embellished. The Australian tip did “not include any mention of the hacking of the DNC, the Russians being in possession of emails, or the public release of any emails,” Durham notes. Downer likewise recounted that Papadopoulos “made no mention of Clinton emails, dirt or any specific approach by the Russian government to the Trump campaign team with an offer or suggestion of providing assistance.”

Durham exposes FBI role in Clinton's Trump-Russia deception
The FBI's Trump-Russia probe was not only baseless, but influenced by an unprecedented Clinton campaign scam.
mate.substack.com

One of the FBI agents I'm London said the Papadopoulos predicate was "thin" and FBI agent Strzok said "there's nothing to this, but we have to run it to ground.

Very informative and fact-dense post.

SaintForLife said:
I don't think Durham investigated the DNC hack. There are some questions about it considering the DNC refused to let the FBI have access to the servers. Also, Crowdstrike CEO said in congressional testimony that they had no evidence of any data being exfiltrated.

There was something hinky about the way that whole deal was handled. Talk about a multi-tiered justice system.

FullMonte · Jul 3, 2023

SaintForLife said:
Also, Crowdstrike CEO said in congressional testimony that they had no evidence of any data being exfiltrated.

Not quite...

--------------------------------------------
CrowdStrike Statement of Response:

The suggestion that CrowdStrike ‘had no proof’ of the data being exfiltrated is incorrect. Shawn Henry clearly said in his testimony that CrowdStrike had indicators of exfiltration ( page 32 of the testimony) and circumstantial evidence (page 75) that indicated the data had been exfiltrated. Also, please note that the Senate Intelligence Committee in April 2020 issued a report (https://www.intelligence.senate.gov/sites/default/files/documents/Report_Volume4.pdf/) validating the previous conclusions of the Intelligence community that Russia was behind the DNC data breach.

--------------------------------------------

iTWire - CrowdStrike chief admits no proof that Russia exfiltrated DNC emails

The controversial American security firm CrowdStrike, which was called in to investigate the alleged Russian hack of DNC servers in 2016, had no proof that any emails from the system had been exfiltrated despite public assertions that this had occurred, according to the transcript of an...

itwire.com

bdb13 · Jul 3, 2023

SaintForLife said:
The Russia probe’s predicating incident – word from Australian diplomat Alexander Downer that Trump volunteer George Papadopoulos may have been offered Russian assistance – was, according to Durham, not only insufficient but embellished. The Australian tip did “not include any mention of the hacking of the DNC, the Russians being in possession of emails, or the public release of any emails,” Durham notes. Downer likewise recounted that Papadopoulos “made no mention of Clinton emails, dirt or any specific approach by the Russian government to the Trump campaign team with an offer or suggestion of providing assistance.”

Durham exposes FBI role in Clinton's Trump-Russia deception
The FBI's Trump-Russia probe was not only baseless, but influenced by an unprecedented Clinton campaign scam.
mate.substack.com

One of the FBI agents I'm London said the Papadopoulos predicate was "thin" and FBI agent Strzok said "there's nothing to this, but we have to run it to ground.

I don't think Durham investigated the DNC hack. There are some questions about it considering the DNC refused to let the FBI have access to the servers. Also, Crowdstrike CEO said in congressional testimony that they had no evidence of any data being exfiltrated.

What was the confirmation of embellishment in regards to what Papadopoulos said that's being referred to there? I didn't see it.

And even in Downer's account there Papadopoulos said that he was aware "the Russians have information."

SaintForLife · Jul 3, 2023

FullMonte said:
Not quite...

--------------------------------------------
CrowdStrike Statement of Response:

The suggestion that CrowdStrike ‘had no proof’ of the data being exfiltrated is incorrect. Shawn Henry clearly said in his testimony that CrowdStrike had indicators of exfiltration ( page 32 of the testimony) and circumstantial evidence (page 75) that indicated the data had been exfiltrated. Also, please note that the Senate Intelligence Committee in April 2020 issued a report (https://www.intelligence.senate.gov/sites/default/files/documents/Report_Volume4.pdf/) validating the previous conclusions of the Intelligence community that Russia was behind the DNC data breach.
--------------------------------------------

iTWire - CrowdStrike chief admits no proof that Russia exfiltrated DNC emails
The controversial American security firm CrowdStrike, which was called in to investigate the alleged Russian hack of DNC servers in 2016, had no proof that any emails from the system had been exfiltrated despite public assertions that this had occurred, according to the transcript of an...
itwire.com

Durham investigation (Update: Sussman acquitted) (3 Viewers)

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