Trump Tracker Too (2 Trump 2 Tracker) (3 Viewers)

[EmBeeFiveOhFour]

The football board had the very useful Daily Trump Tracker thread, which was a good place to briefly discuss the latest ridiculous thing that might have ended 97% of prior Presidential administrations even if it didn't necessarily justify an entire thread devoted to it in 2017-2019 (because of the sheer volume of these things). Since I don't see anything like that here already, I'll add one myself.

 

[superchuck500]

I know.

Yeah, I was just making that clear for the readers.


So looking at the removal and substitution filings, DOJ has cited authority that "scope of employment" for elected officials is quite broad. With the caveat that scope of employment is a test under the law of the state where the allegedly wrongful conduct occurred (presume Trump was in DC when he made the statements?), the consensus among a scattering of cases (including the recent 9/2/20 decision from the Sixth Circuit about allegedly defamatory tweets sent by Senator Elizabeth Warren) is that where an elected official is speaking publicly (or in an interview) about matters of general public or political concern, that person is in the scope of employment.

Looking at Trump's allegedly defamatory comments, they were made in an interview with Bloomberg's Laura Litvan, and originally published via tweet. That tweet says "Statement of President Donald J. Trump" across the top. The content of his remarks about Carroll's accusations include statements about what he believes to be Jean Carroll's political agenda, Brett Kavanaugh, and the Democratic Party.

Again, you can't take DOJ's word for it, and Carroll will make a filing opposing it. And the decision will have to be based on scope of employment law for wherever Trump was when he said those things (assume District of Columbia) - but there is precedent, including at the appellate court level, that these kinds of comments are within the scope of an elected official's employment.

This, also, is separate and apart from the employee status question.

 

[MrScary]

I'd like to see just one defender come up with a rational explanation of why they will continue to support this man even after this (because they will)

 

[superchuck500]

The SDNY removal in the Carroll case has been assigned to district judge Lewis Kaplan. He's a senior judge, been on the bench at SDNY since 1994 (Clinton appointee).

 

[GrandAdmiral]

Yeah, I was just making that clear for the readers.


So looking at the removal and substitution filings, DOJ has cited authority that "scope of employment" for elected officials is quite broad. With the caveat that scope of employment is a test under the law of the state where the allegedly wrongful conduct occurred (presume Trump was in DC when he made the statements?), the consensus among a scattering of cases (including the recent 9/2/20 decision from the Sixth Circuit about allegedly defamatory tweets sent by Senator Elizabeth Warren) is that where an elected official is speaking publicly (or in an interview) about matters of general public or political concern, that person is in the scope of employment.

Looking at Trump's allegedly defamatory comments, they were made in an interview with Bloomberg's Laura Litvan, and originally published via tweet. That tweet says "Statement of President Donald J. Trump" across the top. The content of his remarks about Carroll's accusations include statements about what he believes to be Jean Carroll's political agenda, Brett Kavanaugh, and the Democratic Party.

Again, you can't take DOJ's word for it, and Carroll will make a filing opposing it. And the decision will have to be based on scope of employment law for wherever Trump was when he said those things (assume District of Columbia) - but there is precedent, including at the appellate court level, that these kinds of comments are within the scope of an elected official's employment.

This, also, is separate and apart from the employee status question.

And if my understanding of FTCA is correct, this protection for this incident would last even after Trump is out of office if the judge grants the DOJ's request.

 

[insidejob]

I'm so sick of waking up every day (or so it feels, at least) to see that he's done some new criminal act that he won't be punished for or even admonished for by anyone in his own party.

 

[superchuck500]

And if my understanding of FTCA is correct, this protection for this incident would last even after Trump is out of office if the judge grants the DOJ's request.

Yes, it's based on status at the time of the incident, so the case would continue against the USA.

The named individual defendant literally gets removed from the pleadings as a defendant and the United States is substituted. Actually, here DOJ already tried to do that and the court clerk put Trump's name back in as defendant. I'm not sure that's proper, I think substitution happens upon the Attorney General's certification and only a ruling by the court that the certification is wrong (as a matter of law), does it go back.

In other words, the judge doesn't rule on DOJ's move - it would be the plaintiff (Carroll) who would have to oppose/object to it, and then the judge would rule.

 

[insidejob]

In the "There's Always a Tweet for Everything" world

 

[brandon]

In the "There's Always a Tweet for Everything" world

Talk about calling your shot.

 

[superchuck500]

 

[FullMonte]

I read an interesting thought regarding the defamation case regarding Jean Carroll.

Trump is fighting efforts to compel a DNA sample for whatever reason. If his sister Mary were to provide a sample, would that be sufficient to show a familial match to the sample that Ms. Carroll has? If so, would that be useful to the courts to help compel a sample from Donald?

 

[superchuck500]

I read an interesting thought regarding the defamation case regarding Jean Carroll.

Trump is fighting efforts to compel a DNA sample for whatever reason. If his sister Mary were to provide a sample, would that be sufficient to show a familial match to the sample that Ms. Carroll has? If so, would that be useful to the courts to help compel a sample from Donald?

Familial DNA has been used in criminal cases, so I'm sure it can be used in civl cases, where the evidentiary standards aren't as stringent. There are different kinds of familial DNA and any particular sample needs a qualified expert report to support its use as evidence. There may be other issues involved but I think generally speaking, familial DNA can be a tool in court.

 

[LA - L.A.]

Familial DNA has been used in criminal cases, so I'm sure it can be used in civl cases, where the evidentiary standards aren't as stringent. There are different kinds of familial DNA and any particular sample needs a qualified expert report to support its use as evidence. There may be other issues involved but I think generally speaking, familial DNA can be a tool in court.

If the court rules that Trump is covered by the FTCA, then wouldn't it still be a moot point regarding her defamation lawsuit?

Though, it could still be used in the court of public opinion.

 

[Optimus Prime]

I wonder if these polls were done before the Woodward news broke
=====================================================

With 53 days left before voters decide his political fate, there were stirrings Thursday that suggest the political freefall President Donald Trump has been in for months has not only ended, but that the Electoral College landscape may be starting to move back in his direction, ever so slightly.

The big news came out of the Cook Political Report, one of the preeminent political handicapping services in the country, which moved two states -- Florida and Nevada -- in the President's direction. Florida moved from "lean Democrat" to "Toss Up," while Nevada went from "Likely Democrat" to "Lean Democrat."

"Biden's Electoral College lead has narrowed to 279 to 187 for Trump," wrote Cook's Amy Walter of the moves. "Earlier this summer, Biden held a 308 to 187 lead."

Also on Thursday, The Economist updated its electoral model, writing this:

"In early June The Economist published its own statistical forecasting model for this November's presidential contest to guide such handicapping. Back then, it gave Donald Trump at best a one-in-five chance of winning a second term. But by July, as unrest and the coronavirus ravaged the nation, his odds had slumped to as low as one-in-ten. There they stayed until the middle of August. Now, our model shows Mr Trump has clawed back a sizeable chunk of support."

All of which leads us to the question: Are we seeing the stirring of an actual Trump comeback? Or is the movement effectively a dead-cat bounce rather than a sign of an actual increased chance for Trump to beat former Vice President Joe Biden on November 3?....................

Is Donald Trump starting to make an electoral comeback?

Link to poll referenced in the article:

Electoral College Rating Changes: Florida and Nevada Shift Right

Today we are making two ratings changes in Pres. Trump's favor, moving Florida from Lean Democrat to Toss Up, and Nevada from Likely Democrat to Lean Democrat. Biden's Electoral College lead has narrowed to 279 to 187 for Trump. Earlier this summer, Biden held a 308 to 187 lead.

cookpolitical.com

 

[bdb13]

538 currently has Trump's odds at the lowest since they started their tracker a few months ago.. I do think the bump that Trump has seen in Florida is probably real (who knows if it's temporary or not) but beyond that I don't think the landscape has changed much.

 

[Nebaghead]

I wonder if these polls were done before the Woodward news broke
=====================================================

With 53 days left before voters decide his political fate, there were stirrings Thursday that suggest the political freefall President Donald Trump has been in for months has not only ended, but that the Electoral College landscape may be starting to move back in his direction, ever so slightly.

The big news came out of the Cook Political Report, one of the preeminent political handicapping services in the country, which moved two states -- Florida and Nevada -- in the President's direction. Florida moved from "lean Democrat" to "Toss Up," while Nevada went from "Likely Democrat" to "Lean Democrat."

"Biden's Electoral College lead has narrowed to 279 to 187 for Trump," wrote Cook's Amy Walter of the moves. "Earlier this summer, Biden held a 308 to 187 lead."

Also on Thursday, The Economist updated its electoral model, writing this:

"In early June The Economist published its own statistical forecasting model for this November's presidential contest to guide such handicapping. Back then, it gave Donald Trump at best a one-in-five chance of winning a second term. But by July, as unrest and the coronavirus ravaged the nation, his odds had slumped to as low as one-in-ten. There they stayed until the middle of August. Now, our model shows Mr Trump has clawed back a sizeable chunk of support."

All of which leads us to the question: Are we seeing the stirring of an actual Trump comeback? Or is the movement effectively a dead-cat bounce rather than a sign of an actual increased chance for Trump to beat former Vice President Joe Biden on November 3?....................

Is Donald Trump starting to make an electoral comeback?

Link to poll referenced in the article:

Electoral College Rating Changes: Florida and Nevada Shift Right

Today we are making two ratings changes in Pres. Trump's favor, moving Florida from Lean Democrat to Toss Up, and Nevada from Likely Democrat to Lean Democrat. Biden's Electoral College lead has narrowed to 279 to 187 for Trump. Earlier this summer, Biden held a 308 to 187 lead.

cookpolitical.com

I think he peaked earlier this week. 538 has things starting to ease back towards Biden. 538 also said Florida moved back towards Trump.

 

[superchuck500]

 

[efil4]

I wonder how many there to see AF1.

If you havent seen it rolling along the tarmac, in person, even 2 miles away, its pretty awe-inspiring.

My first home was on Massachusetts in Metairie ( probably 1.25 miles due east of MSY West/East runway ) and planes taking off East would fly right over. When Bush came post Katrina, AF1 flew right over my home on takeoff. It was quite a stunning aircraft.

 

[Taurus]

Makes me think the sound engineer's trolling him.