Trump Indictment ( includes NY AG and Fed documents case ) (1 Viewer)

[SteveSBrickNJ]

Former President D. Trump has been indicted by a New York Grand Jury. There will be much to talk about on this topic because this is just the first step in a lengthy process.
Possibly it is worthy of its own thread here rather than posting about Trump's indictment in already existing threads?
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This 3/31/23 story might get the ball rolling....
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Manhattan’s DA wanted a Friday Trump arrest. Trump’s team said no.

Secret Service needed more time to prepare, according to the ex-president’s legal team.

www.yahoo.com

 

[Snarky Sack]

I think the Democrats welcome Trump running - he already lost to Biden by 7 million votes and 74 electoral votes in 2020. And that was before he tried to pressure states to undo their results and then launched a failed insurrection.

This idea that DOJ made up a case against Trump because the Democrats feared Trump in 2024 is pretty silly. It’s far more logical that his resistance to returning the material became criminal and they aren’t going let him do criminal acts simply because he’s Donald Trump.

Democrats in the U.S. welcome Trump running about as much as Democrats on here welcome a Trump supporter posting.

 

[Huntn]

I think the Democrats welcome Trump running - he already lost to Biden by 7 million votes and 74 electoral votes in 2020. And that was before he tried to pressure states to undo their results and then launching a failed insurrection.

This idea that DOJ made up a case against Trump because the Democrats feared Trump in 2024 is pretty silly. It’s far more logical that his resistance to returning the material became criminal and they aren’t going let him do criminal acts simply because he’s Donald Trump.

A serious concern is (my impression) that several States have or tried to change state law to allow the legislature to snatch away control from the board of electors (correct term?) of any election they don’t like the results of. And there have been moves to replace Election board members with other people more favorable to their party‘s political desires. The recent SCOTUS ruling about gerrymandered districts was a breath of fresh air especially when States think they each should have the individual right to screw with federal election results as they see fit.

 

[Huntn]

Democrats in the U.S. welcome Trump running about as much as Democrats on here welcome a Trump supporter posting.

The reality is this man is the single largest threat to the future of the United States of America since the Civil War, and he projected, has 30m losers* following him, and many of his losers are in charge of crucial States that will likely determine the results of the 2024 Presidential election. And in the 2016 election some of those States made efforts to throw the election that were thwarted. There are reasons to be concerned.

*Loser: Disregard for the leagal rights, and social standards that the USA was founded upon. Their willingness to accept corrupt election results for their politics is chilling, regarding everything we are supposed to stand for.

But I’ve also said that Trump is just a symptom of the disease infecting America. Just because he goes away does not mean we have been cured.

 

[Snarky Sack]

The reality is this man is the single largest threat to the future of the United States of America since the Civil War, and he projected, has 30m losers* following him, and many of his losers are in charge of crucial States that will likely determine the results of the 2024 Presidential election. And in the 2016 election some of those States made efforts to throw the election that were thwarted. The are reasons to be concerned.

*Loser: Disregard for the leagal rights, and social standards that the USA was founded upon. Their willingness to accept corrupt election results for their politics is chilling.

I appreciate your being honest about your reasons to oppose the normal democratic process we use to select the president, and prefer that the DOJ simply "STOP it."

I think what you may want to consider is how you will ensure that this is a one off. If the DOJ succeeds in stopping Trump from being elected, what will then stop the DOJ from exercising this veto power you would grant them against other frontrunners, maybe next time a Democrat that you support?

 

[Snarky Sack]

We've been gaslit by descriptions of evidence that turn out to be inaccurate too many times for a thinking person to simply accept the DOJ's description of the evidence.

Starting with the Steele Dossier, which was described as a set of documents implicating Trump in many crimes, as well as disgusting sexual practices with Russian prostitutes, which turned out to nothing more than a piece of Clinton funded oppo research filled with false information but which the DOJ dressed up as evidence in order to get warrants to spy on the Trump campaign.

See how descriptions of evidence don't always match the reality of the evidence?

The FBI offered Steel $1,000,000 to find some way to make the Dossier true. That's how badly they wanted the stories to be true. Probably the most expensive confirmation bias in FBI history. At least I hope so . . .

FBI offered Steele $1 million to prove dossier claims, senior FBI analyst testifies | CNN Politics

Shortly before the 2016 election, the FBI offered retired British spy Christopher Steele “up to $1 million” to prove the explosive allegations in his dossier about Donald Trump, a senior FBI analyst testified Tuesday.

www.cnn.com

 

[DaveXA]

Democrats in the U.S. welcome Trump running about as much as Democrats on here welcome a Trump supporter posting.

If that's actually true, why haven't you been banned yet? Trumpers are welcome to post as long as they follow the site TOS. We might not like a lot of what's posted, but we also recognize it's a big world out there.

 

[superchuck500]

I appreciate your being honest about your reasons to oppose the normal democratic process we use to select the president, and prefer that the DOJ simply "STOP it."

I think what you may want to consider is how you will ensure that this is a one off. If the DOJ succeeds in stopping Trump from being elected, what will then stop the DOJ from exercising this veto power you would grant them against other frontrunners, maybe next time a Democrat that you support?

The federal prosecution has no bearing on the election - Trump can run, Trump can win, Trump can be president regardless of what happens in the criminal case, and you know this. You have also said you think it helps him in the grand scheme because voters are fed up with this manipulation.

So how is it DOJ stopping Trump? How can it be all of those things at the same time?

 

[DaveXA]

The federal prosecution has no bearing on the election - Trump can run, Trump can win, Trump can be president regardless of what happens in the criminal case, and you know this. You have also said you think it helps him in the grand scheme because voters are fed up with this manipulation.

So how is it DOJ stopping Trump? How can it be all of those things at the same time?

Good luck getting him to actually be consistent on this.

 

[zztop]

But I’ve also said that Trump is just a symptom of the disease infecting America. Just because he goes away does not mean we have been cured.

This reminds me of something someone said (I forget who b/c it was back in like 2015) that if trump wins, people will get the president that they deserve, not the one that they need. During the second election, I figured people would realize things and wake up... only to find out more people voted for him the second time around than the first. This told me that we have a looong ways to go before things get corrected.

 

[Huntn]

I appreciate your being honest about your reasons to oppose the normal democratic process we use to select the president, and prefer that the DOJ simply "STOP it."

I think what you may want to consider is how you will ensure that this is a one off. If the DOJ succeeds in stopping Trump from being elected, what will then stop the DOJ from exercising this veto power you would grant them against other frontrunners, maybe next time a Democrat that you support?

This has nothing to do with disrupting the democratic process, you know it, and you are being disingenuous to suggest it. The premise has to be that you have a lawful Justice Dept. When it is corrupted all bets are off for just about everything, yes?

So far I have not taken you to be a Koolaid drinker, although I have considered you a politically motivated rationalist. This man who I often refer to as The Head Crook is a criminal and a traitor period. In any rational intellectual, factual arena there are zero grounds to debate otherwise.

At a minimum he should of been charged with obstruction of Justice while President, but they held off because, duh, he controlled the Justice Dept with his own hand picked stooges. His list of crimes are long and not made up. Don’t ask me for the list, they are a matter of record.

The current crime, willfully running off with TS documents Is a CRIME, a FELONY. It can not be parsed in any other way. Stop making excuses and equivalence arguments for him. And I’m not talking about other cases were people in leadership positions ended up with classified documents at home. Btw, they all cooperated, and no one else did what he did, willfully directing the loading up of classified documents as he left office to be stored in the spare room, showed off at parties, maybe even used for personal advantage. Anyone else would be prosecuted, period. There have been reports that MarLago was infiltrated by foreign intelligence services. If so, all of of that info is compromised.

It’s long past due that we stop placing Presidents above the law. We did so for Nixon, Regan, Dubya, and now the worst, I wash my mouth out after saying his name. All btw are/were Republicans. <shocker>

I assume by your posts, you not only like Trump, but you think he is what America needs to be a good America. The guy who openly distained, undermined NATO, and disregarded National intelligence for his “strong man” buddy, Vlad. I really have to put my imagination to work to picture what you see. All I can produce is a cross between the Handmaid’s Tail and the Fascist States of America.

You can’t put a corrupt Peice of work like Donald Trump in charge and expect good results from it. If you want to see the Nation implode, maybe. The man is a forking disaster and seriously, support for such putrescence, puts your judgement and motivations into question at least with me. I’m sure you are not surprised.

 

[SFIDC3]

Democrats in the U.S. welcome Trump running about as much as Democrats on here welcome a Trump supporter posting.

I welcome Trump running because I think it practically ensures he will lose and lose badly and it's exactly what the R party deserves....

Then after he loses in humiliating fashion they wrap the court cases up and he goes to jail.....it's a win win for rational/reasonable folks on both sides of the aisle (of which there are not many on the R side).....

 

[Snarky Sack]

If that's actually true, why haven't you been banned yet? Trumpers are welcome to post as long as they follow the site TOS. We might not like a lot of what's posted, but we also recognize it's a big world out there.

Because being a Trump supporter doesn't violate terms of service.

 

[Snarky Sack]

The federal prosecution has no bearing on the election - Trump can run, Trump can win, Trump can be president regardless of what happens in the criminal case, and you know this. You have also said you think it helps him in the grand scheme because voters are fed up with this manipulation.

So how is it DOJ stopping Trump? How can it be all of those things at the same time?

Good point, but I think the doj believed that the indictment itself would reduce Trump's popularity. That's how badly Democrats have misunderstood the pro-trump movement for so long.

Now their strategy will be to delay delay delay so that they can keep putting out negative information about him in an official forum, again hoping to sway the election.

You are our widely respected legal expert. What was the legality of using the steel dossier as evidence to get a warrant, and falsifying an email for the same purpose? What do those two examples indicate to you about the FBI and Department of justice?

 

[Huntn]

Good point, but I think the doj believed that the indictment itself would reduce Trump's popularity. That's how badly Democrats have misunderstood the pro-trump movement for so long.

Now their strategy will be to delay delay delay so that they can keep putting out negative information about him in an official forum, again hoping to sway the election.

You are our widely respected legal expert. What was the legality of using the steel dossier as evidence to get a warrant, and falsifying an email for the same purpose? What do those two examples indicate to you about the FBI and Department of justice?

“but I think the doj believed that the indictment itself would reduce Trump's popularity. That's how badly Democrats have misunderstood the pro-trump movement for so long.”

I disagree with your assessment. Rational people who actually believe in the “American standard” at least as an ideal to be strived for have been repelled by Trump all along, that is if they were not co-conspirators in his nefarious plans, thinking there would be personal benefit trickle down as long as he was around smashing the Federal Govt.

Of course the Koolaid drinkers and MAGA crowd make him out to be their Jesus and martyr. I’ll be bold enough to claim that DOJ knew this all along and Democrats hoped it would not be true but were prepared for such an outcome. The bottom line is you, the DOJ should not shy away from evil, thinking that it will just go away on its own. The big question is what percentage of Americans turn out to be Koolaid drinkers or MAGA and ready to go for broke?

 

[superchuck500]

Good point, but I think the doj believed that the indictment itself would reduce Trump's popularity. That's how badly Democrats have misunderstood the pro-trump movement for so long.

Now their strategy will be to delay delay delay so that they can keep putting out negative information about him in an official forum, again hoping to sway the election.

You are our widely respected legal expert. What was the legality of using the steel dossier as evidence to get a warrant, and falsifying an email for the same purpose? What do those two examples indicate to you about the FBI and Department of justice?

I personally think Democrats want Trump to run, they always have. He’s DOA in a general election. I think Dem strategists welcome Trump running. So I just don’t see that it’s a political prosecution.

I think the problem with the dossier with respect to the FISA warrant is that the FBI did not fully vet it and did notify the court of some inconsistencies - as the Durham investigation concluded. There was other probable cause for the Page warrant, but the court should have been advised.

I think DOJ is very large. And I don’t think everything DOJ does is coordinated at the very top. I think DOJ is generally made up of very good lawyers - I have worked with DOJ many times. I think there can always be errors in judgment or even bad actors and they should be held accountable.

The FBI lawyer (note that is an agency lawyer not a Justice Department attorney) that altered the email was prosecuted, sentenced, and had his bar license suspended. Altering evidence is a very big deal and I assure you the percentage of DOJ lawyers who would engage in that kind of activity knowing the risk (and they all know the risk) is minuscle.

Most DOJ attorneys are “career” professionals, not political appointees. Only the US Attorneys and the political staff at Main DOJ are politicals. All of the other lawyers have long-term careers at DOJ. A federal conviction for altering evidence stays with you forever.

 

[Huntn]

This reminds me of something someone said (I forget who b/c it was back in like 2015) that if trump wins, people will get the president that they deserve, not the one that they need. During the second election, I figured people would realize things and wake up... only to find out more people voted for him the second time around than the first. This told me that we have a looong ways to go before things get corrected.

We absolutely deserve the outcome of the good or bad choices we make. I’m a fatalist in this regard.

 

[DaveXA]

Because being a Trump supporter doesn't violate terms of service.

Which contradicts your earlier post.

 

[CoolBrees]

But then I see your own location, and remember that in 2020, Portland, Oregon showed itself to be the center of the butt crevasse of the United States, so no need to bother.

Tangerine Mussolini sent Blackwater to my city and assaulted women and kidnapped citizens off the street. I remember it well.

But this thread is on the crimes he will actually face justice for.

On top of your obfuscation and refusal to provide any evidence of your opinions, you act like it is only the DOJ that has or more importantly going to indict Fred Drumpf's greatest dissapointment.

Georgia was firmly a red state before Cheeto jeebus. Now still run by the R's. Wanna guess who is going to be the next indictment of Trumplethinskin?

You guessed it! Republican AG of Georgia! Who has him on tape asking R Sec of State to "find" 11,000 votes! And they sat a grand jury in May! And had 75 witnesses testify!

This one has a bit of suspense, as while we can expect the indictment to come down at any time (the jury already returned their verdict), In Georgia, GJ don't actually indict, they give their verdict to a judge who issues the indictment under order.

Here is an article from the local Fox affiliate that distills the case and timeline. Hint: it's soon and it ain't good for the bloated spray tanner.

Security to tighten ahead of potential indictments in Trump election probe

The Fulton County Sheriff’s Office says it is preparing for security as the Trump election probe into whether former President Donald Trump and his allies criminally meddled in the 2020 election in Georgia could result in indictments as early as July.

www.fox5atlanta.com