The Voting Thread (Procedures, Turnout, Legal Challenges)(Update: Trump to file suit in PA, MI, WI, AZ, NV, GA) (1 Viewer)

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    Lapaz

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    There is a lot of push-back from Trump on voting by mail, but most states allow it, and 1/3 allow it without any excuse. His rationale is that it will lead to vast fraud, but of course that isn't his real reason. His real reason is that he thinks it will be worse for conservatives, but studies have shown that states that have instituted much broader voting by mail haven't had any statistical changes in party voting.



    Although, normally voting by mail doesn't affect party votes, I bet it might this year if we have another resurgence of Covid, because I think the right is much more apt to discount the virus than the left. I know that is why Trump is against it.

    Whether you're left or right wing, expanding mail in votes is the right thing to do to reduce the likelihood of spreading the virus, to expand voter participation, and to make it easier for those that do show up to stay distant. It will also allow any people with susceptibilities to remain safer. I think voting by mail could be made extremely secure by having people vote using traditional postal mail, coupled with requiring a confirmation either by phone, email or text. If done by phone, then voters can provide confirmation that can include confirming their form number. If done by email or text, it can include a picture of their form, and then confirmation that that was their form. Rather than staffers individually calling people, this can be automated by having voters call the number, text the number, or email the address provided to them on their form. A website can even be created with a database of those that have voted, and perhaps a link to allow people to confirm their vote was correctly registered. For people without computers, a site can include a means to access the database over the phone with some confirmation information. These types of systems are used extensively by banks and other sites that need security, so I think they are mature enough to use. We could even use such a site for people to confirm their vote on the day of the election.
     
    Yeah, I don't really see where you got that understanding from in the AP article.
    COULD VOTE TALLIES CHANGE?
    Yes. Both election experts and the Georgia secretary of state’s office have said the final vote tallies will almost certainly be different than the unofficial results reported previously. “The outcome will change slightly at the end, more than likely,” says Gabriel Sterling with the secretary’s office.
    The article establishes clearly that the only votes being audited are those cast in the presidential race. Under professional rules of writing, the above statement would only apply to the vote tallies for the presidential race, because that is the only race being audited and mentioned in the article. Under professional rules of writing, if vote tallies for other races could change as well, then the writer should specifically mention that in the statement above.
     
    As an aside, for the purposes of a motion to dismiss under the Federal Rules of Civil Procedure the court is only supposed to consider the contents of the plaintiff's complaint and not any exhibits (or argument from counsel about allegations which aren't in the complaint, which describes most of Rudy's argument) to determine whether a claim has been stated. Which any remotely competent lawyer would know. But I think maybe the animated corpse of Rudy Giuliani is not a competent lawyer.
     


    This really is the crux of it. According to Giuliani (on behalf of Trump), if *any* mail-in ballots should not have been counted for any reason, then *none* of them should have been counted. And without spending the rest of my afternoon following this hearing, that is absolutely freaking insane and it's no wonder that they couldn't find any lawyer but Rudy Giuliani willing or able to make this argument.
     
    The article establishes clearly that the only votes being audited are those cast in the presidential race. Under professional rules of writing, the above statement would only apply to the vote tallies for the presidential race, because that is the only race being audited and mentioned in the article. Under professional rules of writing, if vote tallies for other races could change as well, then the writer should specifically mention that in the statement above.
    Ok. Here's the thing, the other elections are not even in the conversation, Ga SoS says the only election ballots being audited was the presidential election ballots. There is no other election being discussed in the article so when they asked "Can the Vote Tallies Change", they are continuing the talk about the presidential election only.
     


    This really is the crux of it. According to Giuliani (on behalf of Trump), if *any* mail-in ballots should not have been counted for any reason, then *none* of them should have been counted. And without spending the rest of my afternoon following this hearing, that is absolutely freaking insane and it's no wonder that they couldn't find any lawyer but Rudy Giuliani willing or able to make this argument.


    dont fret - hearing paused - line went static for telephone. Judge paused hearing to get resolved. If not resolved, could delay til tomorrow
     
    Ok. Here's the thing, the other elections are not even in the conversation, Ga SoS says the only election ballots being audited was the presidential election ballots. There is no other election being discussed in the article so when they asked "Can the Vote Tallies Change", they are continuing the talk about the presidential election only.
    That's what I said.
     
    dont fret - hearing paused - line went static for telephone. Judge paused hearing to get resolved. If not resolved, could delay til tomorrow

    They did resume and apparently the defense attorney went crazy attacking Giuliani. Some are saying it was overboard and others saying it's an appropriate response. Don't know when we'll get a ruling from the judge tho.
     

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