Possible Mississippi flag change underway (1 Viewer)

< Previous | Next >

Heathen

add me on COD @cautiousmink
Joined
Sep 28, 2019
Messages
625
Reaction score
646
Age
31
Location
Utah
Offline

JACKSON, Miss. (WLBT) - The Mississippi House voted on Saturday to suspend rules, allowing for a vote to take place to change the current state flag.
The vote on House Concurrent 79 was approved by a vote of 85-34. The rule must also be passed by the Senate.
HC 78 also includes the creation of a flag committee. The HCR says the new flag cannot contain the Confederate battle emblem and says the flag must include “In God We Trust.”
The goal is to get the new flag design on ballots in November. If the commission’s design doesn’t get majority approval in November, HCR 79 says the commission would design another new flag.
After the vote, the House adjourned until 2 p.m. Sunday.
The suspension of the rules is the first step to changing the state flag. If passed by the Senate with a two-thirds vote, the vote will then move toward removing the flag, which must also be passed by both the House and Senate. Governor Tate Reeves already said if the resolution on a new flag reaches his desk, he will pass it.
As a resident of Mississippi for the first 20 something-odd years of my life, I'm really happy to see this.

I'm actually very shocked Tate Reeves, who from all indication is supportive of the current flag and movement, will sign whatever decision the state hands to him on a flag change/no change. I guess he might realize he could be ending his reelection campaign early.

If it passes the Senate, the flag will essentially be including 'In God we Trust' in the logo, which pretty undeniably IMO violates the First Amendment of the Constitution.

Here's an excerpt on the ruling in 2004:

Lower courts have upheld use of motto
In Lambeth v. Board of Commissioners of Davidson County (M.D.N.C. 2004), a federal district court in North Carolina determined that the inscription “In God We Trust” on the facade of a government building does not violate the separation of church and state. The following year, the Fourth Circuit Court of Appeals affirmed the lower court decision. In 2006 a U.S. judge in the Eastern District of California wrote in Newdow v. Congress of the United States (C.D. Cal. 2006), “The national motto is excluded from First Amendment significance because the motto ‘has no theological or ritualistic impact’ and is of a purely secular, ‘patriotic’ and ‘ceremonial character.’ ” The words In God We Trust, he said, constitute in effect “a secular national slogan.”
.

I believe one can easily see that the logic behind the phrase having 'no theological impact' and being 'secular' is completely outrageous. Any American knows which particular god that phrase references, and I do expect down the road for this legislation to be deemed unconstitutional. It's one of those common sense items that we know will eventually be corrected, but for now just serves as an irritant. Although it does appease those white residents who aren't outspoken about the confederate flag but don't care if it gets changed either, which seems to be a growing number of people.

Anyway, not to gripe too much. This is HUGE for my home state. Absolutely huge...Today could be a great day in Mississippi history..I'm happy it looks as if tentatively the confederate flag will be coming down.

Awaiting the Senate decision..



Here is the process to remove the State Flag:

1. MS House votes to suspend the rules- DONE
2. MS Senate votes to suspend the rules- PENDING
3. MS House votes on the bill to remove the flag. (Tomorrow at 10AM)
4. MS Senate votes on the bill to remove the flag. (TBA)
5. Governor signs the bill into law.
 
Last edited:

insidejob

Well-known member
Joined
May 21, 2019
Messages
1,685
Reaction score
2,263
Age
85
Location
Back in 70124
Offline
Nationalism does not equate to racism. One can have a desire to push their own national interest over another nation's without being racist. What we have seen in the US and abroad has been racism dressed up in the disguise of nationalism. In the US, we have seen the rise of racism and nationalism has had little to do with it. And that same racism hidden behind nationalism has taken over conservatism.
What passes as conservatism today is unrecognizable compared to what conservatism in the 70's and 80's. Any believer in true conservatism would be actively supporting the removal of trump and every government official that enables him.
I took it for America meaning White Nationalism since that's what's been on the obvious rise since Trump was just a candidate.
 

Farb

Mostly Peaceful Poster
Joined
Oct 1, 2019
Messages
1,392
Reaction score
939
Age
45
Location
Mobile
Offline
Why is this dumb nickname so important to them in the first place? I'd bet it's because the rebel flag is one of them.
I have no idea if it really is important to anyone, I doubt it is. I was using this particular reference to illustrate a point between historical reference and invoking pride in the confederacy. That is all.

I briefly thought of using the statue of liberty but my mind got fuzzy trying to articulate that point, so I found one close to home that I see everyday to help show my point.
 

insidejob

Well-known member
Joined
May 21, 2019
Messages
1,685
Reaction score
2,263
Age
85
Location
Back in 70124
Offline
I have no idea if it really is important to anyone, I doubt it is. I was using this particular reference to illustrate a point between historical reference and invoking pride in the confederacy. That is all.

I briefly thought of using the statue of liberty but my mind got fuzzy trying to articulate that point, so I found one close to home that I see everyday to help show my point.
I understand the point you were making about history vs confederate pride. It just seems like it's such an easy fix, proven by Mississippi on Sunday, that you'd think they'd want to dispose of it sooner than later before it starts getting protested and Mobile has a real problem on their hands. And I'm so sorry you have to live there. My most memorable experience in the city of Mobile was using a Chevron bathroom that had feces on the floors, walls and ceilings and filled the sinks. I had to go so bad that I just opened the door and pissed all over the place to wash some of it away. Had a really good friend from Tillman's Corner and Citronelle (sp) who was gay and everything you wouldn't expect from someone from there - except for his inherent racism which I told him to just never mention around me or we'd cease to be friends. He died of AIDS two years ago and more than half of his family wouldn't show up to his funeral because he was a "gay."
 

Farb

Mostly Peaceful Poster
Joined
Oct 1, 2019
Messages
1,392
Reaction score
939
Age
45
Location
Mobile
Offline
I understand the point you were making about history vs confederate pride. It just seems like it's such an easy fix, proven by Mississippi on Sunday, that you'd think they'd want to dispose of it sooner than later before it starts getting protested and Mobile has a real problem on their hands. And I'm so sorry you have to live there. My most memorable experience in the city of Mobile was using a Chevron bathroom that had feces on the floors, walls and ceilings and filled the sinks. I had to go so bad that I just opened the door and pissed all over the place to wash some of it away. Had a really good friend from Tillman's Corner and Citronelle (sp) who was gay and everything you wouldn't expect from someone from there - except for his inherent racism which I told him to just never mention around me or we'd cease to be friends. He died of AIDS two years ago and more than half of his family wouldn't show up to his funeral because he was a "gay."
I have no idea if it will be protested, I doubt it but who knows.

Oh, you must have found the Chevron on the end of Broad and I-10. They manage to replace the poop on the walls and in the sink every few days so as not to ruin the experience for others in the future. Mobile is a strange city, but it is home and I have a liking to it. It could always be worse. I could live in New Orleans. ;)
 

V Chip

Truth Addict
Joined
May 17, 2019
Messages
775
Reaction score
1,334
Age
53
Location
Outside Atlanta
Offline
I don't have an issue with the "X Flags over [Location]" type of theme showing a version of the Confederate flag.

However, imagine if during WWII, somehow Germany invaded and took over part of the US containing [Location]. Would people be OK with a Nazi flag being shown in those circumstances?
 
  • Thread starter
  • Thread Starter
  • #61
OP
Heathen

Heathen

add me on COD @cautiousmink
Joined
Sep 28, 2019
Messages
625
Reaction score
646
Age
31
Location
Utah
Offline
Do you get points somewhere for always using 'traitor, loser or some other adjective when you type confederate? I know you all think it angers folks but it really just makes you look like you get your thoughts from facebook or something. Same question for 'say it louder for those in the back'. Very cultish.
Just a thought -- not baiting: Would you say the same regarding a Nazi flag?
 

LA - L.A.

Well-known member
Joined
Sep 28, 2019
Messages
1,135
Reaction score
1,335
Location
Studio City, CA
Offline
It just seems to me that ... the confederate flag as a historical symbol when even applied in an historical setting, has been lost and the only symbolism remaining for the flag is slavery, despite the historical context.
Slavery is inseparable from the historical context of the confederate flag. If you remove slavery from American history, then you have no historical reason for the confederacy. There's no way to have one without the other.
 

Farb

Mostly Peaceful Poster
Joined
Oct 1, 2019
Messages
1,392
Reaction score
939
Age
45
Location
Mobile
Offline
Just a thought -- not baiting: Would you say the same regarding a Nazi flag?
I will be honest, but I am not sure what you asking. Are you asking me if I feel like people use strange adjectives when describing the Nazi flag?
Or do I feel it is OK to display the Nazi flag in an historical setting?
 
  • Thread starter
  • Thread Starter
  • #64
OP
Heathen

Heathen

add me on COD @cautiousmink
Joined
Sep 28, 2019
Messages
625
Reaction score
646
Age
31
Location
Utah
Offline
I will be honest, but I am not sure what you asking. Are you asking me if I feel like people use strange adjectives when describing the Nazi flag?
Or do I feel it is OK to display the Nazi flag in an historical setting?
What I'm asking is if you'd have the same reaction to folks using those adjectives when describing the Nazi flag as you do the Confederate one. While I agree that slinging adjectives ad nauseam in most scenarios is a little shallow, what I'm wondering here is how wide the comparison on the scale of 'ethical dilemmas' nazism is to terrorism perpetrated by those who swore allegiance to the confederacy.

Nothing accusatory. Legitimately curious.
 

Farb

Mostly Peaceful Poster
Joined
Oct 1, 2019
Messages
1,392
Reaction score
939
Age
45
Location
Mobile
Offline
I think I got what you are asking and if I got it wrong, its my reading comprehension and not you, so apologies.
You are asking if the random use of adjectives bothers me as much if used about a Nazi flag as opposed to confederate thingys?
I will honestly say, I have never heard adjectives, that I have noticed anyway, used when describing a nazi flags. Maybe becasue to most, 'nazi' is about all that is needed for an adjective.

Maybe that is why there is this trend I have noticed lately about the confederacy and its symbols. That is because "Nazi" already implies 'evil' and 'bad'. While here, especially in the south, the word confederate doesn't hold that negative connotation yet, and the strange constant use of 'traitor', 'loser' ect... helps creates that in the long run? It might be a planned out, random or organic movement to associate the word 'confederate' in the same light that 'Nazi' already holds.

It would not be the first time or the last time that either side (I believe it is more of a left tool in the toolbox obviously) works to change the meaning or connotation of a word or words. It is part of the culture war.
 

zztop

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 5, 2020
Messages
941
Reaction score
1,200
Age
121
Location
in a van down by the river
Offline

"Rosete and nearly 3,000 Mississippians have since submitted designs for a new state flag, some more serious than others. Rosete said he had submitted his flag as a joke, but it made it to the second round of 147 designs "

I have to say this was pretty funny, unfortunately it appears to have been a mistake:

“The mosquito flag advanced to Round Two due to a typo in a list of flag numbers submitted by one commissioner,” the agency said in a statement Tuesday. “That commissioner has requested that the flag be removed from the Round Two gallery, and MDAH staff has complied."
 

insidejob

Well-known member
Joined
May 21, 2019
Messages
1,685
Reaction score
2,263
Age
85
Location
Back in 70124
Offline
Anyone have any ideas as to why they're requiring the new flag to have "In God We Trust" on it? Why go from one controversial flag to another (albeit much less controversial)?
 

Infoman

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 1, 2019
Messages
232
Reaction score
176
Location
Ya mama house
Offline
Anyone have any ideas as to why they're requiring the new flag to have "In God We Trust" on it? Why go from one controversial flag to another (albeit much less controversial)?
When did "In God We Trust" become controversial? Asking for the 85% - 95% or so of the US population (That believes in God in some form or another), the Official motto of the US, and all US printed money? LOL
 
Last edited:

cuddlemonkey

Well-known monkey
Joined
May 17, 2019
Messages
1,237
Reaction score
1,567
Offline
When did "In God We Trust" become controversial? Asking for 85% - 95% or so of the US population (That believes in God in some form or another), the Official motto of the US, and all US printed money? LOL
It was established as the motto in 1956 to show how different this country is from those godless heathen communists, and the first lawsuit challenging it was in 1970, so... almost from the start?
 

Infoman

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 1, 2019
Messages
232
Reaction score
176
Location
Ya mama house
Offline
It was established as the motto in 1956 to show how different this country is from those godless heathen communists, and the first lawsuit challenging it was in 1970, so... almost from the start?
Again, how is it controversial in to the vast majority of the people in the US? And for the purposes of this topic, why should it not be considered by MS to put on the State flag?

If you find it controversial on a personal level (I.e. you don't like it)... then say that... because based on the overwhelming US majority that would not find it controversial (believers) or burn their money because it's in plain sight on every single bit of US currency... there is no controversy.

If you don't like it, say that... or say that there is a fringe group of "heathens" (your word not mine)... that doesn't care for it. (LOL)

But don't call it controversial... because it's not controversial to nearly the entire population of the US.
 

Brandon13

Well-known member
Joined
May 17, 2019
Messages
901
Reaction score
1,549
Location
Pensacola, FL
Offline
Again, how is it controversial in to the vast majority of the people in the US? And for the purposes of this topic, why should it not be considered by MS to put on the State flag?

If you find it controversial on a personal level (I.e. you don't like it)... then say that... because based on the overwhelming US majority that would not find it controversial (believers) or burn their money because it's in plain sight on every single bit of US currency... there is no controversy.

If you don't like it, say that... or say that there is a fringe group of "heathens" (your word not mine)... that doesn't care for it. (LOL)

But don't call it controversial... because it's not to nearly the entire population of the US.
The issue isn't really an active 'controversy' I'd say, but I would actually bet that removing the phrase from money and all would actually get a decent amount of support in opinion polling (maybe 30ish % give or take). Could be wrong but I honestly don't think it would be as low as 5 to 15%.

It's probably a little bit controversial in nature though just being the fact that this would be the first time a state flag contains the phrase so it's an expansion of the use of it.

And yes, personally I would remove the phrase from money and all of that and not put it on a flag.
 

Create an account or login to comment

You must be a member in order to leave a comment

Create account

Create an account on our community. It's easy!

Log in

Already have an account? Log in here.

< Previous | Next >

Users Who Are Viewing This Thread (Users: 0, Guests: 1)

Advertisement

General News Feed

Fact Checkers News Feed

Sponsored

Top Bottom