Israel vs Hamas (4 Viewers)

[GrandAdmiral]

Looks like the fight is on with Israeli soldiers and civilians amongst the dead already. Question becomes, how long before we get dragged into this?

Netanyahu says Israel is ‘at war’ after Hamas launches surprise attack, takes hostages | CNN

Israel’s Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu declared that the country was “at war” on Saturday, after Palestinian militants in Gaza fired a deadly barrage of rockets and sent gunmen into Israeli territory in a major escalation of the long running conflict between the two sides.

www.cnn.com

 

[MT15]

I forgot where I got this info..perhaps an NPR story...most reps lose money when they trade. They perform worse with inside trading than regular trades from regular folks. I'll go search for it sometimes.

If you follow the link above from el in the one tweet where they do give a source - it’s a dashboard called Quiver that shows the disclosed stock trades by MOC, and the one who is there when I clicked on it is Daniel Goldman. You can scroll through and see all the figures in the red, lol. It looks pretty bad to me. I don’t show that many losses, normally, on sales.

 

[DaveXA]

It's closer than you think. Nazism/Fascism are very difficult to pin down. However there are very distinct characteristics...and it doesn't have to be centered around anti-Semitism.

Fascists, probably strong elements of that. Nazism...that's a bit of a different animal.

1. Ultra-nationalism. Imma bet they have this checked.

Both sides definitely have that checked. But that exists in a lot of countries.

2. Militaristic. Yeah, Imma bet their military is central to their society.

That is the core of pretty much every country in that region. If you don't have a military, you're gonna get conquered sooner than later.

3. Racial superiority. Yeah, have you seen how they treat Palestinians?

And? They both do that. Hardly unique characteristic.

4. Disregard for human rights. Have you seen how they indiscriminately grab and kill

They have to some degree. I don't think I've ever seen them massacre women and children like Hamas just did, much less record themselves killing and post it on their victim's FB page.

Palestinians? There are vids out there. Have you seen them walk the streets calling for deaths to Palestinians? Yep. Settlers have been brutalizing those residents in the West bank.

There's some of that but it's not the same.

5. Autocracy. Well not quite there, but moving there.

That ebbs and flows, but it's not really close to it yet. I lot would have to chamge for that to happen.

6. Central dictator/cult leader. Not quite there.

Agreed.

7. Common enemy. Yeah?

Not sure what's unique about this.

8. Expansion for the superior race to grow. Yeah? (Ethiopia - italy and Eastern Europe - germany)

Exactly how much has Israel expanded? I get the settlements angle, we're talking border disputes more than conquering other countries. When Israel conquers say Lebanon or Egypt or something, I'll be right with you.

9. Central religion. You think?

Clearly, charateristic of most ME countries.

10. Control of mass media. Probably not.

Definitely influence, but not control, yes.

11. Cronyism and preferential treatment of industrialists? Idk....well if netanyahu has his way.

Yeah, I'm not a fan of Bibi. I think they need a change in leadership to someone who can offer a fresh vision or approach to the conflict. Not sure that will happen soon though.

These are just some traits that comes to mind. So apart from the antisemitism, and let's replace Jews with Palestinians...I'm sure we can see some similarities.

There are some parallels, sure. I have sympathy for Palestinians, but absolutely none for the violent leadership they relty on in the form of Hamas and Hezbollah.

But let's be clear here, they do have the right to defend themselves...but not to exterminate every living soul in Gaza. I've seen comments such as, we have unleash our military. If heads pop out we shoot. No more rules.

I've said several times that Israel shouldn't raze Gaza to the ground. Doing that to 2.3 million people, many of whom are women and children and innocent people who have nothing to do with Hamas would be an unparalleled atrocity.

I think the siege shouldn't last too long. I would send the military in and make a full sweep of Gaza and clear them of Hamas militants as much as possible, rescue any hostages and require the remaining Palestinians to hold new elections and reconstitute their government and go from there. All of that is gonna take time and effort and it's gonna be a painful process.

I can't predict what Israel does though. For now, vengeance for the massacre is foremost on their minds so it's gonna take some time for cooler heads to prevail.

 

[MT15]

We also need to be careful about believing everything - especially on Twitter. I am not sure the beheading of babies is fully confirmed yet. It’s horrible to even think about it but I did see that the Israeli Army will not confirm that they have found that. It could be meant to elicit an emotional response, we have seen that before.

This guy is debunking what he can:

 

[DaveXA]

We also need to be careful about believing everything - especially on Twitter. I am not sure the beheading of babies is fully confirmed yet. It’s horrible to even think about it but I did see that the Israeli Army will not confirm that they have found that. It could be meant to elicit an emotional response, we have seen that before.

This guy is debunking what he can:

Thank you. My BIL saw the white phosphorus thing and I told him that was fake and would absolutely be all over the news if that were the case.

He reads questionable sources and some of his friends are Trumpers and gun nuts and send him fake news reports from time to time.

 

[UriUT]

Fascists, probably strong elements of that. Nazism...that's a bit of a different animal.

Both sides definitely have that checked. But that exists in a lot of countries.

That is the core of pretty much every country in that region. If you don't have a military, you're gonna get conquered sooner than later.

And? They both do that. Hardly unique characteristic.

They have to some degree. I don't think I've ever seen them massacre women and children like Hamas just did, much less record themselves killing and post it on their victim's FB page.

There's some of that but it's not the same.

That ebbs and flows, but it's not really close to it yet. I lot would have to chamge for that to happen.

Agreed.

Not sure what's unique about this.

Exactly how much has Israel expanded? I get the settlements angle, we're talking border disputes more than conquering other countries. When Israel conquers say Lebanon or Egypt or something, I'll be right with you.

Clearly, charateristic of most ME countries.

Definitely influence, but not control, yes.

Yeah, I'm not a fan of Bibi. I think they need a change in leadership to someone who can offer a fresh vision or approach to the conflict. Not sure that will happen soon though.

There are some parallels, sure. I have sympathy for Palestinians, but absolutely none for the violent leadership they relty on in the form of Hamas and Hezbollah.

I've said several times that Israel shouldn't raze Gaza to the ground. Doing that to 2.3 million people, many of whom are women and children and innocent people who have nothing to do with Hamas would be an unparalleled atrocity.

I think the siege shouldn't last too long. I would send the military in and make a full sweep of Gaza and clear them of Hamas militants as much as possible, rescue any hostages and require the remaining Palestinians to hold new elections and reconstitute their government and go from there. All of that is gonna take time and effort and it's gonna be a painful process.

I can't predict what Israel does though. For now, vengeance for the massacre is foremost on their minds so it's gonna take some time for cooler heads to prevail.

Firstly, the last part from my post wasn't targeted at anyone in particular. Certainly not at you. It is for the general brash idea that Israel can do what they want to do....particular that co and probably the Israeli mindset at the moment. My bad.

The point that I tried to make is that while Israel may not be a full blown fascist/nazi state, it has similar qualities...in the aggregate..particularly points 1-8. And sure if you break down these characteristics individually, you'll see it even america. The point is that Israel meets a good chunk of it....especially how they treat palestinians pervasively in their society. And to samiams point, they need only to take that next step of the final solution to be full blown nazis...despite they are Jews. And as I pointed out, anti semitism needn't be the core...particularly if you replace Palestinians as the target.

Exactly how much has Israel expanded? I get the settlements angle, we're talking border disputes more than conquering other countries. When Israel conquers say Lebanon or Egypt or something, I'll be right with you.

Yeah so it's not about neighboring countries. The West bank is generally considered to be Palestinian lands. Netanyahu have opened that pandora's box to Israeli settlers. And those same settlers are brutalizing the residents there.

Edit. I was not clear with militaristic point. It is more that the military is ingrained as part of the society. Not sure if you remember starship troopers...that's what I meant. 2 Israeli were invited to my high school when I was younger. Their mindset revolve around their service.

Common enemy is like a boogie man. For nazi Germany, the Jews were at the heart of their problems. For Israel, it's that they are surrounded by Arabs .. and cannot be safe.

 

[efil4]

I forgot where I got this info..perhaps an NPR story...most reps lose money when they trade. They perform worse with inside trading than regular trades from regular folks. I'll go search for it sometimes.

Edit..yeah I'm not going to sit through these results. It was a guest interview on the topic of congressional stock trading I listened while in the car and the guest made that point.

But here is one abstract:

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S0047272722000044

I remembered his argument was much more convincing backed by his numbers.

Edit: found it. not if its the same show.

So of you click that quiverquant link in that tweet, it opens to Dan Goldman trades over last year. If you swipe right, takes to column of percent gain/loss.

In January 2023 alone like 30 trades ...6 profitable, 24 not.

So if they trading on inside info, they suck.

March 23 he sold First Bank...for 95% loss.

 

[BullSheetBuddha]

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I can't predict what Israel does though. For now, vengeance for the massacre is foremost on their minds so it's gonna take some time for cooler heads to prevail.

I would say getting as many of the captured back, and the overall safety of Israel moving forward is what is foremost in their minds.

 

[el caliente]

I suppose it odd then that Mo Khanna would site the unusual whale as a resource for his plan against Congressional trading. Are plans in congress usually built on faulty information?

At any rate, love them or hate them, those two sites report on all congressional trading in an unbiased fashion (Notice they site both Republicans and Democrats that are was profiteers). I look forward to the report, and I’ll share it here once it comes available.

 

[el caliente]

 

[el caliente]

These weirdos really put the turd in the punch bowl.

 

[el caliente]

 

[DaveXA]

I would say getting as many of the captured back, and the overall safety of Israel moving forward is what is foremost in their minds.

Probably so. Good point.

 

[DaveXA]

Funny, not funny, but funny.

But, probably only partly true, at least directly. Certainly true indirectly.

 

[coldseat]

What’s the implication? What do you think the implications are? Do you think they are hoping that the war machine gets shut down?

I don’t understand why folks are up in arms here. Politicians being labeled as war profiteers is a bad thing now? Is this not upsetting to you?

I should look for a nice Ilhia Omar quote to bring us all together. Lol

I'm not seeing what that has to do specifically with the current Israeli/Palestinian war. It's a problen in general with a lot of industries for sure, not just the military industrial complex. But unless the implication is that those stock intrest in some way contributed to the start of the war, why bring it up in this thread?

 

[Neworleansfan]

David Horowitz? This one?

David Horowitz

Despite Horowitz being a founding intellectual member of the New Left in the 1960s, and an advocate for civil rights and equality, he has since the late 1980s become a driving force of the anti-Muslim, anti-immigrant and anti-black movements.

www.splcenter.org

 

[el caliente]

I'm not seeing what that has to do specifically with the current Israeli/Palestinian war. It's a problen in general with a lot of industries for sure, not just the military industrial complex. But unless the implication is that those stock intrest in some way contributed to the start of the war, why bring it up in this thread?

I’m absolutely positive that those politicians aren’t pulling for their portfolios to grow as a by product of the defense package we are planning to pen for Isreal and the Ukraine.

David Horowitz? This one?

David Horowitz

Despite Horowitz being a founding intellectual member of the New Left in the 1960s, and an advocate for civil rights and equality, he has since the late 1980s become a driving force of the anti-Muslim, anti-immigrant and anti-black movements.

www.splcenter.org

The very same. Did you watch the video?

 

[UriUT]

Now admitting they were warned by Egypt, but chose to ignore it. Bibi should step down. Let cooler heads and people who aren’t mainly worried about staying out of jail and consolidating their own power lead the country. He is bad news.

Yeah, no. He's forming unity party. Hopefully w/ new emergency powers, he won't do a power grab. Hopefully????

For years, Netanyahu propped up Hamas. Now it’s blown up in our faces

The premier's policy of treating the terror group as a partner, at the expense of Abbas and Palestinian statehood, has resulted in wounds that will take Israel years to heal from

www.timesofisrael.com

According to various reports, Netanyahu made a similar point at a Likud faction meeting in early 2018, when he was quoted as saying that those who oppose a Palestinian state should support the transfer of funds to Gaza, because maintaining the separation between the Palestinian Authority in the West Bank and Hamas in Gaza would prevent the establishment of a Palestinian state.

 

[MT15]

This would seem to be misinformation.