FBI thwarts Michigan "militia" plot to kidnap Michigan Governor (1 Viewer)

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superchuck500

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The group, six of which are identified and charged in the criminal complaint, has been recruiting, including at the 2nd Amendment rally at the Michigan state house earlier this year, and "training" in August. Th group has also allegedly stockpiled weapons and other material for the plan. The plan included talk of kidnapping other governors.

The FBI has now made multiple public comments that right-wing militias are a threat to peace in the United States, particularly as we move toward an uncertain time with a presidential election in the midst of a pandemic.

According to the complaint, a Michigan-based militia group attempted to recruit members for the operation, which included storming the Capitol building in Lansing and take hostages, including Whitmer. The plan was reportedly supposed to be executed before the November 2020 election.

The militia group reportedly held several meetings over the summer where they participated in firearms training and combat drills; they also attempted to build IED devices, which were faulty and did not detonate as planned, according to the complaint.

The group then reportedly decided to abduct the governor at her vacation home and take her to a secure location in Wisconsin for "trial."
https://www.detroitnews.com/story/n...nap-michigan-gov-gretchen-whitmer/5922301002/



Here is the full criminal complaint filed in federal court in Michigan:

 

SFIDC3

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I don't think it's all that much different in terms of fringe groups. They've been around a long time. I'll admit the rhetoric is relatively more ramped up, but I'm not sure the groups out there are all that much different than in the past. I mean, there was Waco, the OKC bombing, the attack on the softball game, the attack on Gabby Giffords, Ruby Ridge, and the list goes on. All of those things happened more than 4 years ago. So those people/groups who intend to do harm have always been out there.
Yeah, I think the difference is there is the real threat that they have become, for lack of a better term, emboldened....during the Trump administration. If folks don't think this is not evidence of that then they are simply in denial.....stand down and stand by, from the POTUS. If that doesn't turn one against him then nothing will....
 

DaveXA

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Yeah, I think the difference is there is the real threat that they have become, for lack of a better term, emboldened....during the Trump administration. If folks don't think this is not evidence of that then they are simply in denial.....stand down and stand by, from the POTUS. If that doesn't turn one against him then nothing will....
Maybe, but I'm not so sure that would matter to many of the fringe groups out there. They're gonna do what they do regardless of who says what in office. So I'm a bit skeptical that the likelihood of something happens is any more or less likely than is normal in a given election cycle.

I acknowledge I could be wrong. Time will tell.
 

B4YOU

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I don't think it's all that much different in terms of fringe groups. They've been around a long time. I'll admit the rhetoric is relatively more ramped up, but I'm not sure the groups out there are all that much different than in the past. I mean, there was Waco, the OKC bombing, the attack on the softball game, the attack on Gabby Giffords, Ruby Ridge, and the list goes on. All of those things happened more than 4 years ago. So those people/groups who intend to do harm have always been out there.
I don’t know that these are comparable:
Waco - religious cult that the FBI stormed
OKC bombing - 2person terrorist attack
softball game - lone gunman
Gabby Giffords - lone gunman
Ruby Ridge - family that FBI stormed

This is a group of whose members already where part of an armed group that entered the capital. We are talking 13 men planning a kidnapping of a Governor to overthrow a government. This is part terrorism, part armed coup. I think we see seditious conspiracy charges. This charge is extremely rare and actual conviction hasn’t happened in 25 years.

This whole thing is crazy Q-anon and online radicalization stuff that has run rampant among some groups. Americans having lost the ability to reason are backsliding into a new dark age.

 

Optimus Prime

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I don't get the point here? Is this sarcasm or not?

Because...
I just feel like I’m hearing the word militia far too often

I think it’s like how racist/white supremacists turned into “white nationalists”

Meant to soften the blow of what they actually are
 

DaveXA

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I don’t know that these are comparable:
Waco - religious cult that the FBI stormed
OKC bombing - 2person terrorist attack
softball game - lone gunman
Gabby Giffords - lone gunman
Ruby Ridge - family that FBI stormed

This is a group of whose members already where part of an armed group that entered the capital. We are talking 13 men planning a kidnapping of a Governor to overthrow a government. This is part terrorism, part armed coup. I think we see seditious conspiracy charges. This charge is extremely rare and actual conviction hasn’t happened in 25 years.

This whole thing is crazy Q-anon and online radicalization stuff that has run rampant among some groups. Americans having lost the ability to reason are backsliding into a new dark age.

I think what I was trying to get at is that fringe groups and lone fanatics are not new. They've always been there. Now the overall numbers may be higher and the risk of attacks may be marginally higher, but I think it's not all that much so.

Granted, this particular case is unusual and definitely cause for concern. If other similar events like this or others we're talking about, then I'd be more worried. I guess what I'm saying is it's too soon to start worrying about numbers of assassinations happening in multiple places. We should still be vigilant and prepared for anything that might happen, but I'm not ready to say it will happen.
 

SaulGoodmanEsq

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I don't think it's all that much different in terms of fringe groups. They've been around a long time. I'll admit the rhetoric is relatively more ramped up, but I'm not sure the groups out there are all that much different than in the past. I mean, there was Waco, the OKC bombing, the attack on the softball game, the attack on Gabby Giffords, Ruby Ridge, and the list goes on. All of those things happened more than 4 years ago. So those people/groups who intend to do harm have always been out there.
I didn't mean to suggest it is limited to just extremists. Twenty years of the likes of Rush Limbaugh, Sean Hannity and the new wave of internet personalities like Ben Shapiro have pushed more people into an 'us vs. them' mentality. Bush v. Gore was basically a pre-school fight compared to the tone of Trump vs. Biden.

And I'm not saying we are going to see a wave of politically motivated killings. However, I would not at all be surprised to see an increase in acts of violence (including attempted murder) against politicians that are essentially demonized by extreme partisans. We have been a steady decline for a while now and there is no putting the genie back into the bottle.
 

DaveXA

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I didn't mean to suggest it is limited to just extremists. Twenty years of the likes of Rush Limbaugh, Sean Hannity and the new wave of internet personalities like Ben Shapiro have pushed more people into an 'us vs. them' mentality. Bush v. Gore was basically a pre-school fight compared to the tone of Trump vs. Biden.

And I'm not saying we are going to see a wave of politically motivated killings. However, I would not at all be surprised to see an increase in acts of violence (including attempted murder) against politicians that are essentially demonized by extreme partisans. We have been a steady decline for a while now and there is no putting the genie back into the bottle.
Fair enough. And I do see what you're saying. I do think there's a way forward, but it's going to require some changes in how we talk and treat each other. It can happen. But yeah, the rhetoric has to change to where we can respectfully disagree with one another and get rid of our prejudices.
 

CajuninVA

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If it was a group of American born Muslim citizens calling themselves a militia, do you think any law enforcement organization would have used any word other than terrorist?

Law enforcement is still avoiding calling them what they actually are. There's a reason for that and it's not a good reason.
If Amy Coney Barrett does it, it’s Constitutional law based on the faith of the founders and if a Muslim were to do it, it’s Sharia... hypocrisy has found a home on the Right, aided by their unique ability to label things and have them stick while simultaneously being Teflon coated from having facts stick to them.
 

CoolBrees

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We can do this all day.....

Do you think if BLM had stormed an occupied state building they would have been negotiated with?

Do you think if Muslim traditionalists stood across the street from a Christian church, armed to the teeth that they would have been just exercising their 2nd amendment rights?

Do you think is DeShawn Roof would have waking into a white church and shot the parishioners execution style he would have lived to stand trial

Do you think a black student, caught assaulting a passed out girl behind a dumpster would have gotten off with a light sentence because he was a good kid who was drunk and made a mistake

Do you think that if a black teen killed four people while drunk in a pickup truck would have the affulenza defense even deployed let alone successfull?

I can go on and on. But to no end. Our finer posters and Muricans would just tune it out.
 

DaveXA

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We can do this all day.....

Do you think if BLM had stormed an occupied state building they would have been negotiated with?

Do you think if Muslim traditionalists stood across the street from a Christian church, armed to the teeth that they would have been just exercising their 2nd amendment rights?

Do you think is DeShawn Roof would have waking into a white church and shot the parishioners execution style he would have lived to stand trial

Do you think a black student, caught assaulting a passed out girl behind a dumpster would have gotten off with a light sentence because he was a good kid who was drunk and made a mistake

Do you think that if a black teen killed four people while drunk in a pickup truck would have the affulenza defense even deployed let alone successfull?

I can go on and on. But to no end. Our finer posters and Muricans would just tune it out.
What are you getting at? I'm not sure who this is addressing or what the point of the post is.
 

CoolBrees

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The double standard that exists.

the post above mine discussed the Muslim vs Christian law and how each is treated. I was expounding on that point
 

SaintForLife

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So NOW the people are who are advocating and planning violence and crime are "anarchists." Cute. Lovely. So. So. predictable.

lol. If any non-white people were remotely involved we'd here the quacking ducks.....ANTIFA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! BLM!!!!!!!!

MUH LAW AND ORDER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

party and ideology of "conservatism" lol. It's a pathetic pathology at this point.
What were you saying about BLM?
 
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Nebaghead

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What were you saying about BLM?
Are you saying this terrorist group was part of the BLM organization? Or one guy arrested attended a protest and was upset about George Floyd. A lot of people on both sides were upset about what happened to George Floyd, except racists and bigots.
I guess your point is not everyone in right wing terrorist groups are racists?
 

B4YOU

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I think the Slate does a good job explaining this group.
Some of these groups—including this one, which, had it succeeded, would have been the season’s most brazenly violent—seem to be inspired not by white supremacist ideology or left/right partisanship, but rather by an off-the-cliff radical variant of a feeling deeply rooted in American culture: fear and hatred of government.
I also think it’s fair to ask who most echos the message of these kind of groups? Who denies that these groups are a major threat?
 

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