Civil War 2? (1 Viewer)

Users who are viewing this thread

    Optimus Prime

    Well-known member
    Joined
    Sep 28, 2019
    Messages
    11,832
    Reaction score
    15,619
    Age
    48
    Location
    Washington DC Metro
    Online
    Very sobering article
    ================
    If you know people still in denial about the crisis of American democracy, kindly remove their heads from the sand long enough to receive this message: A startling new finding by one of the nation’s top authorities on foreign civil wars says we are on the cusp of our own.

    Barbara F. Walter, a political science professorat the University of California at San Diego, serves on a CIA advisory panel called the Political Instability Task Force that monitors countries around the world and predicts which of them are most at risk of deteriorating into violence.

    By law, the task force can’t assess what’s happening within the United States, but Walter, a longtime friend who has spent her career studying conflicts in Syria, Lebanon, Northern Ireland, Sri Lanka, the Philippines, Rwanda, Angola, Nicaragua and elsewhere, applied the predictive techniques herself to this country.

    Her bottom line: “We are closer to civil war than any of us would like to believe.” She lays out the argument in detail in her must-read book, “How Civil Wars Start,” out in January. “No one wants to believe that their beloved democracy is in decline, or headed toward war,” she writes.

    But, “if you were an analyst in a foreign country looking at events in America — the same way you’d look at events in Ukraine or the Ivory Coast or Venezuela — you would go down a checklist, assessing each of the conditions that make civil war likely.

    And what you would find is that the United States, a democracy founded more than two centuries ago, has entered very dangerous territory.”

    Indeed, the United States has already gone through what the CIA identifies as the first two phases of insurgency — the “pre-insurgency” and “incipient conflict” phases — and only time will tell whether the final phase, “open insurgency,” began with the sacking of the Capitol by Donald Trump supporters on Jan. 6.

    Things deteriorated so dramatically under Trump, in fact, that the United States no longer technically qualifies as a democracy. Citing the Center for Systemic Peace’s “Polity” data set — the one the CIA task force has found to be most helpful in predicting instability and violence — Walter writes that the United States is now an “anocracy,” somewhere between a democracy and an autocratic state.

    U.S. democracy had received the Polity index’s top score of 10, or close to it, for much of its history. But in the five years of the Trump era, it tumbled precipitously into the anocracy zone; by the end of his presidency, the U.S. score had fallen to a 5, making the country a partial democracy for the first time since 1800.

    “We are no longer the world’s oldest continuous democracy,” Walter writes. “That honor is now held by Switzerland, followed by New Zealand, and then Canada. We are no longer a peer to nations like Canada, Costa Rica, and Japan, which are all rated a +10 on the Polity index.”…….

    Others have reached similar findings. The Stockholm-based International Institute for Democracy and Electoral Assistance put the United States on a list of “backsliding democracies” in a report last month.

    “The United States, the bastion of global democracy, fell victim to authoritarian tendencies itself," the report said.

    And a new survey by the academic consortium Bright Line Watch found that 17 percent of those who identify strongly as Republicans support the use of violence to restore Trump to power, and 39 percent favor doing everything possible to prevent Democrats from governing effectively……



     
    Creepy and weird are very much subjective, right?

    You have a point about gun owners being good to have in a war zone. I agree. So did the guys who wrote the 2nd. That was 100% their point as well.
    I am the arbiter of creepy and weirdness. But I do love the inexplicably conjoined worship of the 1st and 2nd Amendment... I'm no Bible scholar but I'd wager Jesus Christ never carried a weapon.
     
    Except, that embryo has lost is ability of self agency. You are basically arguing who's life is more important. The result of that question is one will be inconvienced and might not be able to school right away ect..... the other is death.

    Well, the state is responsible for protection of the weak of society, so yes, the state has to be involved. How the state is involved is up to those who live in the state.
    You've got to be effing kidding me.

    Ask your mom how much of a cakewalk pregnancy is.
    It's a serious medical condition with lifelong consequences. Women die from it. They're all irrevocably changed by it.

    BUT: Even if it was a minor inconvenience, it still wouldn't matter. It's her body, she gets to say who stays in it and who doesn't. Period. If I needed a blood sample from you in order to live, you'd be ok with the government tying you down and taking it? I don't believe that for a second.

    This is why people say you hate women. You're simply incapable of putting them on the same level as yourself.
     
    I am the arbiter of creepy and weirdness. But I do love the inexplicably conjoined worship of the 1st and 2nd Amendment... I'm no Bible scholar but I'd wager Jesus Christ never carried a weapon.

    A 'scourge' once. And there's the time he cursed a fig tree for not having figs.
     
    You've got to be effing kidding me.

    Ask your mom how much of a cakewalk pregnancy is.
    It's a serious medical condition with lifelong consequences. Women die from it. They're all irrevocably changed by it.

    BUT: Even if it was a minor inconvenience, it still wouldn't matter. It's her body, she gets to say who stays in it and who doesn't. Period. If I needed a blood sample from you in order to live, you'd be ok with the government tying you down and taking it? I don't believe that for a second.

    This is why people say you hate women. You're simply incapable of putting them on the same level as yourself.
    You cannot be forced to donate a kidney or even a cornea after you are dead! That’s how seriously our society takes bodily autonomy. Unless you are a woman…
     
    The woman has the ultimate say in self determination when it comes to having a baby. She is in total control up until she has another life inside her from her own actions.

    Why did the woman lose the right to self determination once pregnant? Because you or some other politician decided that for her? Sorry, but the potential human life in the form of an embryo unable to support its own life is not sufficient for a woman to lose her own right to self determination. Certainly not for the government to take that right of self determination away from her. Doesn't matter how many times you make the same, tired argument.
     
    Last edited:
    This civil war 2 thread has somehow meandered off into an abortion discussion and I feel that I'm partially to blame for that. Some people believe in women having all the same rights as men. Others don't. But that shouldn't be the discussion here.

    This thread was started due to the complete split in the US between people who actually believe in the constitution and the founding principles of this nation and those that are frightened that they are somehow being replaced. We should get back to discussing that rather than abortion.
     
    I'm not interested in proving a negative. The rest of the article was simply based on conjecture rooted in the religious beliefs. Nice try but next time, find something more credible to quote than an organization described as "a fringe anti-LGBTQ hate group that masquerades as the premier U.S. association of pediatricians".
    So the answer is no? LOL.

    https://evolutionnews.org/2020/02/when-does-human-life-begin/

    "However, from a scientific standpoint, at the moment of fertilization of the egg by the sperm, a completely new organism is present. The organism is not a part of the mother’s body although he or she is located within the mother’s body. Half of the time, the organism is a boy. The genetic complement of the new human being is unique and different from that of the mother."

    Can you show me the science that shows that a fertilized egg is just a clump of cells? What would you call it?
     
    I mean, there are several videos of them doing just that on this board. But I guess we should act like that's not happening.

    You think the guys in Idaho where just there for shirts and giggles?
    I have no idea what you are talking about. I want to see
     
    You've got to be effing kidding me.

    Ask your mom how much of a cakewalk pregnancy is.
    It's a serious medical condition with lifelong consequences. Women die from it. They're all irrevocably changed by it.

    BUT: Even if it was a minor inconvenience, it still wouldn't matter. It's her body, she gets to say who stays in it and who doesn't. Period. If I needed a blood sample from you in order to live, you'd be ok with the government tying you down and taking it? I don't believe that for a second.

    This is why people say you hate women. You're simply incapable of putting them on the same level as yourself.
    They are not on the same level as me. I am a male and females, by nature are superior. That is why men have always been the ones doing the killing and getting killed, to protect the only way our species has to survive. I know it sounds primitive, but we are animals after all.

    Again, no one cares about the women's bodies. Do want you want, but we do care about the the other body that she might be carrying (part of that is also the father).
     
    This civil war 2 thread has somehow meandered off into an abortion discussion and I feel that I'm partially to blame for that. Some people believe in women having all the same rights as men. Others don't. But that shouldn't be the discussion here.

    This thread was started due to the complete split in the US between people who actually believe in the constitution and the founding principles of this nation and those that are frightened that they are somehow being replaced. We should get back to discussing that rather than abortion.
    I help in the train the wreck, but honestly, if we are discussing how the country is split, abortion and 2A seem to be at the forefront for the split, so maybe they are no disconnected as one might think.
     
    Why did the woman lose the right to self determination once pregnant? Because you or some other politician decided that for her? Sorry, but the potential human life in the form of an embryo unable to support its own life is not sufficient for a woman to lose her own right to self determination. Certainly not for the government to take that right of self determination away from her. Doesn't matter how many times you make the same, tired argument.
    Not political, but biological. You will have to take that up with God or who or whatever you think created/evolved us.
     
    I help in the train the wreck, but honestly, if we are discussing how the country is split, abortion and 2A seem to be at the forefront for the split, so maybe they are no disconnected as one might think.
    I disagree. I think the country is split along the lines of one side respecting the constitution on the other side wanting the shirt on it because they have been led to believe that they are in some kind of danger of having their existence threatened. When half of the country supports someone who openly and with the support of 100 members of congress tried to commit a coup, the problems go beyond abortion and gun rights. A discussion cannot be had when one side can't/won't acknowledge reality.
     
    They are not on the same level as me. I am a male and females, by nature are superior. That is why men have always been the ones doing the killing and getting killed, to protect the only way our species has to survive. I know it sounds primitive, but we are animals after all.

    Again, no one cares about the women's bodies. Do want you want, but we do care about the the other body that she might be carrying (part of that is also the father).

    Except if they're even, prior possession takes precedence. IE: It was her body first, it's still her body. She has the right to evict anyone or anything she doesn't want in it.
     
    Not political, but biological. You will have to take that up with God or who or whatever you think created/evolved us.

    There's nothing biological about a woman losing her right to self determination because she becomes pregnant. That is exclusively political.

    And if you have to take it up with God, you're not discussing constitutional rights any longer. You're talking about your personal religious beliefs and that should stay exactly where the constitution states it should, out of our laws.
     
    I disagree. I think the country is split along the lines of one side respecting the constitution on the other side wanting the shirt on it because they have been led to believe that they are in some kind of danger of having their existence threatened. When half of the country supports someone who openly and with the support of 100 members of congress tried to commit a coup, the problems go beyond abortion and gun rights. A discussion cannot be had when one side can't/won't acknowledge reality.
    So, you are fully on board with the 2A as written, no infringement?
    Of course you disagree.
    Still not buying into the whole 'coup' conspiracy. Do you think the committee will return a call for criminal charges against Trump?
     
    Except if they're even, prior possession takes precedence. IE: It was her body first, it's still her body. She has the right to evict anyone or anything she doesn't want in it.
    Unless the CDC says she can't due to a pandemic.
    You make it sound like women get pregnant from walking outside. You do know there is one very specific act that requires 2 people to make that happen correct?
     
    There's nothing biological about a woman losing her right to self determination because she becomes pregnant. That is exclusively political.

    And if you have to take it up with God, you're not discussing constitutional rights any longer. You're talking about your personal religious beliefs and that should stay exactly where the constitution states it should, out of our laws.
    Whoever you think is responsible for how humans are created in this world is who you should take it up with is what I said. I think God did it that way. You probably think mother nature, or science or Herman Melville for all I know, and don't care. Simple fact is that is how humans are created. But you knew that, you are smart guy.
     

    Create an account or login to comment

    You must be a member in order to leave a comment

    Create account

    Create an account on our community. It's easy!

    Log in

    Already have an account? Log in here.

    General News Feed

    Fact Checkers News Feed

    Back
    Top Bottom