Autocracy and Trump (1 Viewer)

Richard

Well-known member
Staff member
Joined
Oct 6, 2018
Messages
469
Reaction score
1,057
Location
Soso, MS
Offline
When Trump began to show admiration for autocrats around the world, I thought he was simply revealing his inexperience in foreign policy matters. I passed off his chumminess with the leaders of North Korea and Turkey as playing to the cameras and he would certainly understand that diplomacy is more than flattery. But he continued to express admiration for autocratic leaders like Xi of China, Putin of Russia and dictator wannabes like Bolsonaro of Brazil. I have become convinced that he sees himself as someone who should take a more autocratic position as POTUS and has thrown out ways to make it so.

I believe the first definitive declaration by Trump in this regard was his statement a year ago that the Constitution in Article II gives him the right to do "anything I want to do" as president. Then in April of this year, he told America that "when somebody is President of the United States, the authority is total." He dropped any pretense that he wants to protect the rule of law and abide by the Constitution. So he does an end run around Congress and reallocates funds intended for another purpose to more construction of his wall. Congress said no, but he can do what he wants apparently and the judiciary let him do it.

Now he signs a series of executive orders usurping congressional authority over taxation and appropriation of funds. He has no legal authority to direct funds for the payment of unemployment benefits and his order regarding the deferment of payroll taxes is as illegal as it is absurd. But having the authority to do things doesn't matter to a man who believes his authority is total and that he can do anything he wants. Add to these things his attempts to sidestep election laws, his interference with the US Postal Service, his willingness to ignore commitments to foreign governments and nations and a desire to use division among Americans to bolster his own position. He is an autocrat. He just hasn't hit on the right mechanism with which to solidify his power and hold onto his office indefinitely.
 
  • Thread Starter
  • Thread starter
  • Moderator
  • #3
OP
Richard

Richard

Well-known member
Staff member
Joined
Oct 6, 2018
Messages
469
Reaction score
1,057
Location
Soso, MS
Offline
He may never leave willingly, but he will most definitely leave. How much chaos and damage to the country he does on the way out is another matter entirely.
 

Mr. Blue Sky

Still P***** at Yoko
Joined
Feb 4, 2020
Messages
531
Reaction score
970
Location
Between the Moon and New York City
Offline
He may never leave willingly, but he will most definitely leave. How much chaos and damage to the country he does on the way out is another matter entirely.




Presidential ‘norms’ mean nothing anymore.. with all the shenanigans at the postal service, and the fact that Trump’s enablers in Washington will stop at nothing to help him- I honestly dont see how he loses in November, then after that they can gerrymander or rejigger or do whatever to insure that he’s basically King... I got no dog in the fight, I’m just some idiot on the internet who kinda likes what America has always stood for.. That seems to be changing drastically under this guy, and so be it.. What do I have, only another 30 or 40 years left on the planet, tops.. As Trump himself says ‘It is what it is.’
 

MT15

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 13, 2019
Messages
4,817
Reaction score
7,927
Location
Midwest
Offline
I listened to a livestream from an author who had studied authoritarianism around the world. His bleak view is that we are running out of time to get in Trump’s way. He says that people who say “he can’t do that, it’s unconstitutional or illegal or immoral” are missing the point.

He doesn’t care about any of that. Not one speck. He will do what he wants, unless someone stops him. And we have a pretty spotty record so far in this country of stopping him.

ETA: It was this guy. He posted this today:

7455AA6D-D997-46DD-ACB6-EFB9960E841F.jpeg
 

GrandAdmiral

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 20, 2019
Messages
1,832
Reaction score
2,350
Location
Center of the Universe
Offline
I listened to a livestream from an author who had studied authoritarianism around the world. His bleak view is that we are running out of time to get in Trump’s way. He says that people who say “he can’t do that, it’s unconstitutional or illegal or immoral” are missing the point.

He doesn’t care about any of that. Not one speck. He will do what he wants, unless someone stops him. And we have a pretty spotty record so far in this country of stopping him.

ETA: It was this guy. He posted this today:

View attachment 2108

Yeah. He's discussed this several times and he's right about a lot of it.
 

Mr. Blue Sky

Still P***** at Yoko
Joined
Feb 4, 2020
Messages
531
Reaction score
970
Location
Between the Moon and New York City
Offline
I listened to a livestream from an author who had studied authoritarianism around the world. His bleak view is that we are running out of time to get in Trump’s way. He says that people who say “he can’t do that, it’s unconstitutional or illegal or immoral” are missing the point.

He doesn’t care about any of that. Not one speck. He will do what he wants, unless someone stops him. And we have a pretty spotty record so far in this country of stopping him.

ETA: It was this guy. He posted this today:

View attachment 2108








.


THIS... This whole thing.. All yall assuming he cant do it simply have y’all’s heads in the sand.
 

MT15

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 13, 2019
Messages
4,817
Reaction score
7,927
Location
Midwest
Offline
I have read tweets that a bipartisan group is “war-gaming” what Trump could do to disrupt and/or steal the election. I’m hoping that is true. This guy is a lawyer who I started following on Twitter because he seems to have good, level headed takes. Even he sees the danger.

1F24E2CA-EBC7-4A42-B7F8-3F5B13A8A82E.jpeg
 

wardorican

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 14, 2019
Messages
3,567
Reaction score
4,028
Age
41
Location
Ft. Lauderdale
Offline
When Trump began to show admiration for autocrats around the world, I thought he was simply revealing his inexperience in foreign policy matters. I passed off his chumminess with the leaders of North Korea and Turkey as playing to the cameras and he would certainly understand that diplomacy is more than flattery. But he continued to express admiration for autocratic leaders like Xi of China, Putin of Russia and dictator wannabes like Bolsonaro of Brazil. I have become convinced that he sees himself as someone who should take a more autocratic position as POTUS and has thrown out ways to make it so.

I believe the first definitive declaration by Trump in this regard was his statement a year ago that the Constitution in Article II gives him the right to do "anything I want to do" as president. Then in April of this year, he told America that "when somebody is President of the United States, the authority is total." He dropped any pretense that he wants to protect the rule of law and abide by the Constitution. So he does an end run around Congress and reallocates funds intended for another purpose to more construction of his wall. Congress said no, but he can do what he wants apparently and the judiciary let him do it.

Now he signs a series of executive orders usurping congressional authority over taxation and appropriation of funds. He has no legal authority to direct funds for the payment of unemployment benefits and his order regarding the deferment of payroll taxes is as illegal as it is absurd. But having the authority to do things doesn't matter to a man who believes his authority is total and that he can do anything he wants. Add to these things his attempts to sidestep election laws, his interference with the US Postal Service, his willingness to ignore commitments to foreign governments and nations and a desire to use division among Americans to bolster his own position. He is an autocrat. He just hasn't hit on the right mechanism with which to solidify his power and hold onto his office indefinitely.
I'm not sure if this one is worse than the other time he did this. I believe he took funds marked for the Pentagon and re appropriated them to his border wall. Now, that has some specific restrictions.

You're post is very good and I agree, but I'd be a lot more succinct. His entire style of presidency, and the prevailing mentality of the Whitehouse / DOJ (with Barr), is to do what he wants, and force Congress or the SCOTUS to "make me".

"you can't do that!"

"make me"

I'm not even sure the original Federalists would be pushing for this level of authority in the executive.
 

wardorican

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 14, 2019
Messages
3,567
Reaction score
4,028
Age
41
Location
Ft. Lauderdale
Offline
I believe there was a joke earlier about how much does it cost to get a conservative to change their view on spending, presidential authority, and welfare?

$1200.

That stimulus check.

Richard, if you haven't read the book or seen the play, I'd highly recommend, "It Can't Happen Here". It's pretty spot on about the potential rise of authoritarianism in the US, how easy it would be to get people to flip, etc. I think the used Huey P Long as the character reference of the President, but Nixon, Trump, and European facists would fit the bill too.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/It_Can't_Happen_Here written in 1935.
 

Farb

Mostly Peaceful Poster
Joined
Oct 1, 2019
Messages
1,996
Reaction score
1,172
Age
46
Location
Mobile
Offline
We will know in November and I have a feeling none of this will happen or will come close to happening besides a massive overreaction to a tweet.
 

brandon

Well-known member
Joined
May 17, 2019
Messages
1,417
Reaction score
2,493
Offline
That will depend on the mail in ballots in reality. If people showed up in person to vote, then we would know shortly there after.
Will we?

Because the spectre of "mail-in voting" has already been raised, it really doesn't matter now if people show up to vote. If he loses, he can blame mail-in voting and you'll believe it, regardless of what percentage of the vote the mail-in voting actually makes up.
 

Farb

Mostly Peaceful Poster
Joined
Oct 1, 2019
Messages
1,996
Reaction score
1,172
Age
46
Location
Mobile
Offline
I will believe Trump? You sure about that?
 

Farb

Mostly Peaceful Poster
Joined
Oct 1, 2019
Messages
1,996
Reaction score
1,172
Age
46
Location
Mobile
Offline
You can tilt to windmills all day, I won't stop you.
 

Create an account or login to comment

You must be a member in order to leave a comment

Create account

Create an account on our community. It's easy!

Log in

Already have an account? Log in here.

Users who are viewing this thread

Advertisement

General News Feed

Fact Checkers News Feed

Sponsored

Top Bottom