All things political. Coronavirus Edition. (2 Viewers)

[Maxp]

I fear we are really going to be in a bad place due to the obvious cuts to the federal agencies that deal with infectious disease, but also the negative effect the Affordable Care act has had on non urban hospitals. Our front line defenses are ineffectual and our ability to treat the populous is probably at an all time low. Factor in the cost of healthcare and I can see our system crashing. What do you think about the politics of this virus?

 

[el caliente]

 

[SaintForLife]

CNN —
The US Department of Energy has assessed that the Covid-19 pandemic most likely came from a laboratory leak in China, according to a newly updated classified intelligence report.

Two sources said that the Department of Energy assessed in the intelligence report that it had “low confidence” the Covid-19 virus accidentally escaped from a lab in Wuhan.

Intelligence agencies can make assessments with either low, medium or high confidence. A low confidence assessment generally means that the information obtained is not reliable enough or too fragmented to make a more definitive analytic judgment or that there is not enough information available to draw a more robust conclusion……

US Energy Department assesses Covid-19 likely resulted from lab leak, furthering US intel divide over virus origin | CNN Politics

The US Department of Energy has assessed that the Covid-19 pandemic most likely came from a laboratory leak in China, according to a newly updated classified intelligence report. The assessment further adds to the divide in the US government over whether the pandemic began in China in 2019 as...

www.cnn.com

According to MT15, this was already debunked.

 

[MT15]

According to MT15, this was already debunked.

It has been. This article doesn’t say what you and el think it does. Did either of you even read the article?

Also: this is what the science is saying:

 

[MT15]

Also, another thread. This one is longer so I will just post the first 2 tweets. He goes on in the thread, you don’t have to pay to read his article to get the gist of what he says.

 

[MT15]

And this salient point about what the article actually says:

 

[el caliente]

Like Dr. Faucci, I too am open to all theories as to how this thing got out to the public.

 

[el caliente]

 

[J-DONK]

This is about it. I think Lab Leak seems the most probable. I just hope we get a definitive answer one day.

This is one federal agency. There is not a consensus amongst them on the origin. Some say lab leak other's say zoonotic is more likely.

There does need to be a deep examination into WHY Lab Leak was so widely disregarded early on. That was not good science.

I watched a 60 minutes program that did a deep dive on conflicts of interest in the WHO investigation, and the made a case for lab leak. A good chunk of this board acted like I was talking about alien probes. There is still a resistance to acknowledge the motive of funding cuts. If the virus is not of a zoonotic origin, what happens to all that research? Well it's stopped again. Some people act like these guys got a PHD, and become living saints.

 

[MT15]

Nobody is disregarding anything. The fact of the matter is that genetic evidence has all but definitively ruled out the lab leak hypothesis. This is fairly recent, so of course you can all find people opining about lab leak from before the genetic evidence was gathered.

Lab leak was seriously considered, and then disproven, no matter how much you guys want to believe it. I posted links to the studies, and I have now posted some new posts saying the same thing.

 

[MT15]

This is about it. I think Lab Leak seems the most probable. I just hope we get a definitive answer one day.

This is one federal agency. There is not a consensus amongst them on the origin. Some say lab leak other's say zoonotic is more likely.

the federal agency in question gives its conclusion “low confidence”. And the entire virology scientific community - who know how to read the genetic evidence - now says that natural origin is all but certain.

And even this Fed Dept says it definitely wasn’t part of a bio-weapon research program, the article says there is general consensus on that.

It’s fine to consider all options, but at some point the genetic evidence has to be considered and it has satisfied the virology community who has the scientific knowledge. That’s enough for me at this time.

 

[RobF]

Prediction before I even look: whatever he said after "The biggest drug cartels in the world get together and buy up all the media" makes it much more anti-vaxy.

*Looks*

"The biggest drug cartels in the world get together and buy up all the media and all the politicians and force all the people in the world to stay locked in their homes. And people can only come out if they take the cartel’s drugs and keep taking them over and over."

Yeeeeeeah, that's not great.

 

[el caliente]

Prediction before I even look: whatever he said after "The biggest drug cartels in the world get together and buy up all the media" makes it much more anti-vaxy.

*Looks*

"The biggest drug cartels in the world get together and buy up all the media and all the politicians and force all the people in the world to stay locked in their homes. And people can only come out if they take the cartel’s drugs and keep taking them over and over."

Yeeeeeeah, that's not great.

I didn’t even watch the opening monologue at first. I saw the media response, and then I watched the opening monologue. Sure as shirt, the media was angry.

I found the comments like, “wait until they hear how he (Woody) feels about global warming/being vegan/ the use of pot/etc.” to be funnier than the opening monologue. Folks can’t seem to get past someone like them having a differing opinion.

Oh well.

 

[MT15]

I didn’t even watch the opening monologue at first. I saw the media response, and then I watched the opening monologue. Sure as shirt, the media was angry.

I found the comments like, “wait until they hear how he (Woody) feels about global warming/being vegan/ the use of pot/etc.” to be funnier than the opening monologue. Folks can’t seem to get past someone like them having a differing opinion.

Oh well.

Some differing opinions deserve to be made fun of and criticized, which is free speech as well. Anti-vaxxers are responsible for people getting sick and dying needlessly. So, yes, anger and ridicule is an appropriate response to that nonsense.

Seems like free speech only counts when it’s something you agree with.

 

[el caliente]

Some differing opinions deserve to be made fun of and criticized, which is free speech as well. Anti-vaxxers are responsible for people getting sick and dying needlessly. So, yes, anger and ridicule is an appropriate response to that nonsense.

Seems like free speech only counts when it’s something you agree with.

What are you talking about, I’m fine with all free speech.

I’m fine with what he said, I would be fine with him saying the opposite. Like I said, I’m like Dr. Fauci, I’m open to hearing all opinions on the matter of Covid.

 

[SaintForLife]

It has been. This article doesn’t say what you and el think it does. Did either of you even read the article?

Also: this is what the science is saying:

It seems like Hotez has some obvious conflicts of interest. I don't think he should be looked at as some neutral source.

 

[MT15]

What are you talking about, I’m fine with all free speech.

I’m fine with what he said, I would be fine with him saying the opposite. Like I said, I’m like Dr. Fauci, I’m open to hearing all opinions on the matter of Covid.

I don’t think I believe that, based on your posting history. Nothing personal, just an observation. I think you like the right wing conspiracy theories better than the boring scientific facts.

 

[MT15]

It seems like Hotez has some obvious conflicts of interest. I don't think he should be looked at as some neutral source.

Hotez isn’t a neutral source, he’s a subject matter expert. He’s a scientist and his work is checked by his fellow virologists all over the world. But you put your faith in random people on Twitter, who don’t understand what they’re talking about if you want.

Just like the MD I saw on Twitter who said (going from memory, but the gist is correct) - After 4 years of college, 4 years of medical school, 3 years of residency and 10 years of medical practice, I was just told that I don’t know anything about vaccines or Covid by someone who used to copy off of me in HS Biology class.

That’s how these people come across, at least to me.

 

[coldseat]

It has been. This article doesn’t say what you and el think it does. Did either of you even read the article?

Also: this is what the science is saying:

I've been wondering what stake the Department of Energy has in this drama and whom at the department concluded that Covid most likely came with from lab leak. Was it really a group of physicist or do they actually have virologist at the DOE? Why were they involved in investigating this?

I guess I don't know what all goes on at the DOE, but it seemed odd to me that they would have a different conclusion than almost everybody else, even is it was of low confidence.

I think the most important thing to remember is that we don't have complete clarity on how Covid came about, and that's all due to the Chinese governments obfuscation. That is very bad because if we don't have the information and clarity to know for certain how it started, we can't make changes to make it less likely to happen next time.