All Things LGBTQ+ (9 Viewers)

[Farb]

Didn't really see a place for this so I thought I would start a thread about all things LGBTQ since this is a pretty hot topic in our culture right now

https://www.cnbc.com/2021/06/17/sup...y-that-refuses-to-work-with-lgbt-couples.html

• The Supreme Court on Thursday delivered a unanimous defeat to LGBT couples in a high-profile case over whether Philadelphia could refuse to contract with a Roman Catholic adoption agency that says its religious beliefs prevent it from working with same-sex foster parents.
• Chief Justice John Roberts wrote in an opinion for a majority of the court that Philadelphia violated the First Amendment by refusing to contract with Catholic Social Services once it learned that the organization would not certify same-sex couples for adoption.

I will admit, I was hopeful for this decision by the SCOTUS but I was surprised by the unanimous decision.

While I don't think there is anything wrong, per se, with same sex couples adopting and raising children (I actually think it is a good thing as it not an abortion) but I also did not want to see the state force a religious institution to bend to a societal norm.

 

[Farb]

I am happy to use whatever pronouns LGBTQIA+ wants. I do that voluntarily.

I would protest if the state forced me do that.

Lastly, I would not want to be shamed if I made an error with the pronouns

This.
I will call you Sir Tranny of Trannyvale if you asked, I don't care. I do care if you I am forced to call you something that is not based in reality by the state or anyone else for that matter, mistake or not.

 

[samiam5211]

This.
I will call you Sir Tranny of Trannyvale if you asked, I don't care. I do care if you I am forced to call you something that is not based in reality by the state or anyone else for that matter, mistake or not.

So if he asked you to call him that it's ok.

If he demands you call him that, it's not ok.

Seems how a mature adult would handles the situation.

The only difference in those two situations is your ego.

 

[Paul]

So if he asked you to call him that it's ok.

If he demands you call him that, it's not ok.

Seems how a mature adult would handles the situation.

The only difference in those two situations is your ego.

The use of pronouns should not be coerced by the state. BTW, that also applies to "he or she". Compelled speech is not acceptable in our society.

 

[SaulGoodmanEsq]

This.
I will call you Sir Tranny of Trannyvale if you asked, I don't care. I do care if you I am forced to call you something that is not based in reality by the state or anyone else for that matter, mistake or not.

The dignitary harm must be unbearable. You should sue for emotional damages.

 

[Taurus]

So if he asked you to call him that it's ok.

If he demands you call him that, it's not ok.

Seems how a mature adult would handles the situation.

The only difference in those two situations is your ego.

Don't try to tell me you react the same to requests and demands. No adult does.

 

[Paul]

So if he asked you to call him that it's ok.

If he demands you call him that, it's not ok.

Seems how a mature adult would handles the situation.

The only difference in those two situations is your ego.

I demand that you call me "His Royal Highness" because I am a highborn with blue blood. If you fail to do so you have violated state law and there may be a fine.

Hopefully, this will make you realize that your point needs refinement.

 

[samiam5211]

Don't try to tell me you react the same to requests and demands. No adult does.

I'm not sure what to say since you have preordained me a liar.

I guess I'm just a beta, because i really don't care. If i find the request/demand reasonable, it don't care how nicely i am asked.

 

[Paul]

I'm not sure what to say since you have preordained me a liar.

I guess I'm just a beta, because i really don't care. If i find the request/demand reasonable, it don't care how nicely i am asked.

That is OK. The real issue is that the government cannot compel specific speech from the citizens.

 

[Taurus]

I'm not sure what to say since you have preordained me a liar.

I guess I'm just a beta, because i really don't care. If i find the request/demand reasonable, it don't care how nicely i am asked.

Man, that really throws a wrench in my "using preferred pronouns is just good manners" argument.
I thought everyone understood basic manners.
Guess that's what I get for assuming.

 

[samiam5211]

Man, that really throws a wrench in my "using preferred pronouns is just good manners" argument.
I thought everyone understood basic manners.
Guess that's what I get for assuming.

I think you're right. it is just good manners.

We shouldn't let someone else not having good manners change how we behave though. I will call someone by whatever pronoun they want to be called by as long as I am aware.

 

[Farb]

I think you're right. it is just good manners.

We shouldn't let someone else not having good manners change how we behave though. I will call someone by whatever pronoun they want to be called by as long as I am aware.

I agree with everything you just said....crazy, I know.

But, what happens if you slip up and call the lady the with Adam's apple and beard a 'sir' by mistake? You would be cool with a fine by the police for your slip up in good manners?

 

[samiam5211]

I agree with everything you just said....crazy, I know.

But, what happens if you slip up and call the lady the with Adam's apple and beard a 'sir' by mistake? You would be cool with a fine by the police for your slip up in good manners?

That's not ever going to happen.

I know Tucker has you afraid of that, but that has never happened, and won't.

 

[SystemShock]

So if he asked you to call him that it's ok.

If he demands you call him that, it's not ok.

Seems how a mature adult would handles the situation.

The only difference in those two situations is your ego.

To be fair, I'd react very differently to "could you please pass the salt?" and "GIVE ME THE DAMN SALT!!", and I'm willing to bet, you too.

 

[SystemShock]

I demand that you call me "His Royal Highness" because I am a highborn with blue blood. If you fail to do so you have violated state law and there may be a fine.

Hopefully, this will make you realize that your point needs refinement.

Are you pre-op royal highness or post-op royal highness?
Do you at least live as royal highness?

 

[V Chip]

 

[Paul]

That is the way it should be. I applaud Lovato.

However, this is wrong:

1439.51.​

(a) Except as provided in subdivision (b), it shall be unlawful for a long-term care facility or facility staff to take any of the following actions wholly or partially on the basis of a person’s actual or perceived sexual orientation, gender identity, gender expression, or human immunodeficiency virus (HIV) status:

(5) Willfully and repeatedly fail to use a resident’s preferred name or pronouns after being clearly informed of the preferred name or pronouns.

Bill Text - SB-219 Long-term care facilities: rights of residents.

 

[V Chip]

That is the way it should be. I applaud Lovato.

However, this is wrong:

1439.51.​

(a) Except as provided in subdivision (b), it shall be unlawful for a long-term care facility or facility staff to take any of the following actions wholly or partially on the basis of a person’s actual or perceived sexual orientation, gender identity, gender expression, or human immunodeficiency virus (HIV) status:

(5) Willfully and repeatedly fail to use a resident’s preferred name or pronouns after being clearly informed of the preferred name or pronouns.

Bill Text - SB-219 Long-term care facilities: rights of residents.

That would depend on what the penalties are for #5. Since this regards state facilities, there might be the need to have it in a law in order to fire a person for violating the rule.

Do you know the penalty?

Do you agree that someone should be fired if they willfully and repeatedly fail to honor the name or pronouns of a patient in the care of an assisted living facility? One would think common courtesy would be enough to have a caretaker respect a patients wishes, but obviously courtesy is not always common.

 

[coldseat]

That is the way it should be. I applaud Lovato.

However, this is wrong:

1439.51.​

(a) Except as provided in subdivision (b), it shall be unlawful for a long-term care facility or facility staff to take any of the following actions wholly or partially on the basis of a person’s actual or perceived sexual orientation, gender identity, gender expression, or human immunodeficiency virus (HIV) status:

(5) Willfully and repeatedly fail to use a resident’s preferred name or pronouns after being clearly informed of the preferred name or pronouns.

Bill Text - SB-219 Long-term care facilities: rights of residents.

I don't think that should be a law or is that it's in accordance with the first amendment, but I do think that's cause for an employer to fire and employee. Not for a mistake, but for "willfully and repeatedly".