FBI official under investigation after allegedly altering document in 2016 Russia probe (DOJ IG Report thread) (1 Viewer)

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    bdb13

    bdb13

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    Washington (CNN) —
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    An FBI official is under criminal investigation after allegedly altering a document related to 2016 surveillance of a Trump campaign adviser, several people briefed on the matter told CNN.

    The possibility of a substantive change to an investigative document is likely to fuel accusations from President Donald Trump and his allies that the FBI committed wrongdoing in its investigation of connections between Russian election meddling and the Trump campaign.

    The finding is expected to be part of Justice Department Inspector General Michael Horowitz's review of the FBI's effort to obtain warrants under the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act on Carter Page, a former Trump campaign aide. Horowitz will release the report next month.

    Horowitz turned over evidence on the allegedly altered document to John Durham, the federal prosecutor appointed early this year by Attorney General William Barr to conduct a broad investigation of intelligence gathered for the Russia probe by the CIA and other agencies, including the FBI. The altered document is also at least one focus of Durham's criminal probe.
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    www-m.cnn.com

    Exclusive: Former FBI lawyer under investigation after allegedly altering document in 2016 Russia probe - CNN Politics

    A former FBI lawyer is under criminal investigation after allegedly altering a document related to 2016 surveillance of a Trump campaign adviser, several people briefed on the matter told CNN.
    www-m.cnn.com www-m.cnn.com

    Terrible if true. Trump will obviously seize upon this.
     
    SaintForLife said:
    I've read some of the IG report already. Those tweets I posted have screenshots of the relevant portions of the IG report. I'm not planning on reading the entire report. Are you? If you think those screenshots aren't accurate or cherry picked then point out specifically what's wrong. Do you have information that would refute those parts of the IG report I posted?
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    I'm honestly just not sure what insight I'm supposed to gleam from those tweets and screenshots. I don't know what connection it has to anything or even if the interpretation of the tweet accurately reflects the snippet of the screenshot. It's not immediately obvious they're connected, but it's immediately obvious the tweet author want's us to assume they are.

    I just think hearing your own interpretation of the report would add more to the discussion. The tweets are just kind of meh.
     
    It’s obvious that partisan folks who want to discredit the investigation in order to defend Trump are going to focus on the issues found by the IG, without ever once mentioning the overriding conclusion of the report.

    Trump and Bondi made a mockery of the whole report already, Barr and Durham have taken the extraordinary step of releasing statements already touting their own incomplete investigation in an attempt to discredit the report. Why do any of you suppose that is?

    Most rational people who have perused the report have responded differently. Like so: there are problems with the FISA application process and some issues with the FBI not completely following proper procedures and the report highlights several issues with this that need to be addressed. The FBI will be working to correct these issues and that‘s a great thing. The IG found there was no political motivation for the investigation, and there was sufficient reason to open the investigation. That’s good news for our country. This is the proper way to respond to this report, IMO, and it should be the way the president and the AG responded, if they weren’t bent on tearing this country apart.

    I seriously doubt anyone here has ever been through a thorough investigation by an outside body. They always find things that need to be fixed or improved. 100% of the time. We at the hospital have a week long inspection every other year. We end up with a list of things that we need to correct. That doesn’t mean we aren’t doing our jobs and doing them well. It’s the nature of inspections to find issues and bring them out in the open. We still do things correctly and put out top notch work. It only makes us better to go through such a process.
     
    MT15 said:
    It’s obvious that partisan folks who want to discredit the investigation in order to defend Trump are going to focus on the issues found by the IG, without ever once mentioning the overriding conclusion of the report.

    Trump and Bondi made a mockery of the whole report already, Barr and Durham have taken the extraordinary step of releasing statements already touting their own incomplete investigation in an attempt to discredit the report. Why do any of you suppose that is?

    Most rational people who have perused the report have responded differently. Like so: there are problems with the FISA application process and some issues with the FBI not completely following proper procedures and the report highlights several issues with this that need to be addressed. The FBI will be working to correct these issues and that‘s a great thing. The IG found there was no political motivation for the investigation, and there was sufficient reason to open the investigation. That’s good news for our country. This is the proper way to respond to this report, IMO, and it should be the way the president and the AG responded, if they weren’t bent on tearing this country apart.

    I seriously doubt anyone here has ever been through a thorough investigation by an outside body. They always find things that need to be fixed or improved. 100% of the time. We at the hospital have a week long inspection every other year. We end up with a list of things that we need to correct. That doesn’t mean we aren’t doing our jobs and doing them well. It’s the nature of inspections to find issues and bring them out in the open. We still do things correctly and put out top notch work. It only makes us better to go through such a process.
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    I think overall i agree with you. I mean I think the FISA system is fatally flawed and should be done with but that is not what this report is about.

    But, I also think its fairly routine that people do not accept internal investigations. I think that is the whole idea behind setting up citizen police review boards in communities - people don't trust police investigating themselves.
     
    I think that the IG is set up to be independent, although I don’t know that definitively.

    I felt nauseous listening to Trump and Bondi on the radio on the way home. They’re both incapable of having an honest conversation about this report. It’s so damaging to the country in so many ways. It’s fundamentally dishonest in the extreme. We deserve better leadership.
     
    I just read the IG Executive Summary and how anyone could spin anything positive out of that is beyond me.

    There are only two conclusions possible.

    The FBI is grossly incompetent or the FBI involved in Crossfire Hurricane was willing to let proper protocol and procedure slide in this case.

    I guess most named in the report are hoping no one actually bothers to read any of it.

    While there may have been sufficient reason to open the investigation, there was also ample exculpatory information that should have closed it.

    Instead it was omitted so that the investigation could continue.

    Obvious fishing expedition.
     
    SaintForLife said:
    Yeah the FBI would never lie about anything.
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    I don't necessarily agree with his interpretation. It sounds to me, as I read that, that the FBI did not brief Trump's campaign about the items that were being investigated, but that they did provide an intelligence briefing.

    I'm not sure what he thinks the FBI should be doing. When you are investigating a group for illegal activities, you don't give them a briefing to tell them that you are investigating them.

    Now, that's based on just reading that one highlight, and not reading the actual chapter it refers to.
     
    JimEverett said:
    I think overall i agree with you. I mean I think the FISA system is fatally flawed and should be done with but that is not what this report is about.

    But, I also think its fairly routine that people do not accept internal investigations. I think that is the whole idea behind setting up citizen police review boards in communities - people don't trust police investigating themselves.
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    I think it is a mistake to paint local and state police internal investigation and federal IG investigations with the same brush.
     
    The Finding of the IG report was that the investigation was warranted and unbiased.

    The rest is political ground cover for a baseless investigation. As someone a lot smarter than me once said “there is no there, there.”
     
    Archies Ghost said:
    I just read the IG Executive Summary and how anyone could spin anything positive out of that is beyond me.

    There are only two conclusions possible.

    The FBI is grossly incompetent or the FBI involved in Crossfire Hurricane was willing to let proper protocol and procedure slide in this case.

    I guess most named in the report are hoping no one actually bothers to read any of it.

    While there may have been sufficient reason to open the investigation, there was also ample exculpatory information that should have closed it.

    Instead it was omitted so that the investigation could continue.

    Obvious fishing expedition.
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    So, I have read the summary and I will make my way through the report over the next week. And you're right that it isn't good, it's along the lines of what I expected. The FBI became convinced they were pursuing guilty people and started playing fast and loose with the rules and facts. That's not a good thing.

    However, I don't see how Trump supporters can find comfort in this either. Trump viciously savaged people doing their job,and then asked people to lie to the FBI and the Mueller investigation. Do you wonder why the FBI and others became convinced his campaign was guilty?

    Yes the FBI should be above that and follow everything perfectly, but if you think this is the first time the FBI got sloppy and it was due to political bias, I think your wrong. They're human and when people start acting in ways that fits into they're experience of following the patterns of guilty people they start to treat them like guilty people.
     
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    I was just coming in to point this out, UTJ. When the people involved in an investigation lie to the investigators said investigators are going to become convinced they are on to something. It’s not unusual, it’s almost always true that guilty people lie.
     
    Archies Ghost said:
    I just read the IG Executive Summary and how anyone could spin anything positive out of that is beyond me.

    There are only two conclusions possible.

    The FBI is grossly incompetent or the FBI involved in Crossfire Hurricane was willing to let proper protocol and procedure slide in this case.

    I guess most named in the report are hoping no one actually bothers to read any of it.

    While there may have been sufficient reason to open the investigation, there was also ample exculpatory information that should have closed it.

    Instead it was omitted so that the investigation could continue.

    Obvious fishing expedition.
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    The IG report definitively stated that FBI never disclosed in the multiple FISA applications that Steele was "desperate that Trump not get elected and passionate about him not being the US President" so it's confusing that the report said there wasn't any bias.

    It is clear from the IG report that there was no legitimate basis for the FISA warrant on Carter Page. We've been told the claim that the Steele Dossier was central to the Russia investigation was a Republican conspiracy theory. We now know they wouldn't have got the Page FISA warrant without the Steele Dossier.

    The FBI made 9 false statements to the FISA court. The IG report detailed 17 major issues and there were 51 Woods procedure violations.
     
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    Archies Ghost said:
    I just read the IG Executive Summary and how anyone could spin anything positive out of that is beyond me.

    There are only two conclusions possible.

    The FBI is grossly incompetent or the FBI involved in Crossfire Hurricane was willing to let proper protocol and procedure slide in this case.

    I guess most named in the report are hoping no one actually bothers to read any of it.

    While there may have been sufficient reason to open the investigation, there was also ample exculpatory information that should have closed it.

    Instead it was omitted so that the investigation could continue.

    Obvious fishing expedition.
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    (AGAIN, I HAVEN'T READ THE REPORT YET)

    There are more than two conclusions possible, and I think that there is one that is much more likely.

    Over the course of a huge investigation that lasted this long, the overall operation was done properly, but there were mistakes, some critical, that were made. It's not gross incompetence, and it's not someone intentionally letting procedures slide.

    To make an analogy: There are only two possible conclusions based on this Sunday's Saints game, either the Saints are a horrible football team who has been coasting all year, or the San Francisco 49'ers are the best football team in the league right now.
     
    samiam5211 said:
    I'm not sure where you get the idea that a dossier started the Russia investigation.
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    Since I am actually reading the IG report I thought I would post relevant snippets.

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    The Steele "reporting", considered to be internet rumor by the CIA is " central and essential" to the FISA application.

    The application itself was falsified.

    Information that was exculpatory in nature was routinely withheld, allowing the investigation to continue.

    What is in the report is pretty damning and Barr and Durham both think it is a white wash.
     
    SaintForLife said:
    The IG report definitively stated that FBI never disclosed in the multiple FISA applications that Steele was "desperate that Trump not get elected and passionate about him not being the US President" so it's confusing that the report said there wasn't any bias.
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    I thought it said there wasn't political bias. The point being is that Steele was probably convinced that Trump was a criminal or compromised. Still biased but for different motivations
     
    UncleTrvlingJim said:
    I thought it said there wasn't political bias. The point being is that Steele was probably convinced that Trump was a criminal or compromised. Still biased but for different motivations
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    Didn't the attorney who altered the e-mail so that it read that Carter Page had not been a CIA source make a statement like, "viva la resistance?"

    It sure seems like why see political bias from the same people we see malfeasance from, and some of us are quick to accept a statement that the two are not connected.

    I'll bet that some of those people that accept that so readily also believe that police departments should not investigate their own.

    This sure has the same feel as when Comey laid out a lot of damning facts about Hillary, but conveniently found butter didn't mean to.
     
    Archies Ghost said:
    I just read the IG Executive Summary and how anyone could spin anything positive out of that is beyond me.

    There are only two conclusions possible.

    The FBI is grossly incompetent or the FBI involved in Crossfire Hurricane was willing to let proper protocol and procedure slide in this case.

    I guess most named in the report are hoping no one actually bothers to read any of it.

    While there may have been sufficient reason to open the investigation, there was also ample exculpatory information that should have closed it.

    Instead it was omitted so that the investigation could continue.

    Obvious fishing expedition.
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    I’m glad Republicans(and those that caucus with them) decided to come around on impeachment....oh wait, I forgot, abuse of power is only a thing people can be accused of under Democratic administrations looking into matters affecting a Republican.

    A president directs his administration to possibly illegally hold up critical congressional passed national security funds and direct a foreign head of state to investigate debunked conspiracies to damage his political rival by contacting his AG, then trying to cover it up by altering transcripts and hiding conversations to avoid damaging exposure: fake news, president has absolute authority, not impeachable yada yada....some agents, in a part of a legitimately started investigation, get loose with one particular process in a process Republicans have continually reauthorized in its entirety despite crocodile tears of its overreach when narratives suit them, Abuse of power! The real Russia story! Utterly Damning!

    How this party should be taken seriously anymore is beyond me.
     
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    So the obtaining of the FISA warrant to surveil Page is not equal to the beginning of the Russia investigation as I understand it. The origins of the Russia investigation were found to be justified and not politically influenced. Apparently this needs to be emphasized again and again.

    The report clearly shows that the agents in the FBI were more or less just like the population at large in that there was a split in who they wanted elected. There were factions that were cheering for Trump, and factions that didn’t want Trump to be elected. There were some interesting pms between agents supporting Trump found by the IG. Is that going to be trumpeted now to prove that the FBI was in the tank for Trump? Do you all see how silly that sounds?

    This idea that there was some sort of “deep state” or coup attempt is really just pathetic propaganda. It’s time for people pushing this nonsense to just stop. It’s incredibly damaging to our nation. The agents of the FBI are just like the rest of the population, they have their political preferences, but they are able to put them aside to do the job they need to do.

    Christopher Steele was even a personal friend of Ivanka Trump according to the report. He doesn’t hate the Trump family. He cooperated with the IG. His dossier wasn’t even in the possession of the FBI until two weeks after the investigation was launched. This is just all so much total nonsense.
     
    Archies Ghost said:
    Since I am actually reading the IG report I thought I would post relevant snippets.

    1575952685300.png


    1575952860896.png


    1575953047035.png


    1575953297737.png


    The Steele "reporting", considered to be internet rumor by the CIA is " central and essential" to the FISA application.

    The application itself was falsified.

    Information that was exculpatory in nature was routinely withheld, allowing the investigation to continue.

    What is in the report is pretty damning and Barr and Durham both think it is a white wash.
    Click to expand...

    Didn‘t Papadopoulos plead guilty to “making false statements” to the FBI? So you’re upset that his lies weren’t included in the application?

    There were parts of the Dossier that have been proven to be accurate. So there were useful parts of the dossier that could be used.

    There are parts of the report that certainly don’t further your agenda, by the way, but you aren’t giving those parts any attention, which is the definition of cherry picking.

    Barr has no leg to stand on anymore in any pretense of being fair or open to finding the truth. He stated his conclusions before he started investigating. He’s nothing if not a political operator at this point in time.

    The FBI didn’t spy on the Trump campaign, the Steele dossier wasn’t essential to opening the investigation, Steele doesn’t hate Trump, there is no “deep state” conspiracy against Trump. These are all fantasies.
     

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