The Bhagavad Gita and the Bible (1 Viewer)

[SystemShock]

Be assured that he who worships me, perishes not.
He that believeth in me shall never perish, but shall have eternal life.

I am the beginning and the middle and the end of things.
I am Alpha, Omega, the beginning and the ending.

God incarnated, born to a virgin mother, persecuted by the King, who orders all newborns killed.
God incarnated, born to a virgin mother, persecuted by the King, who orders all newborns killed.

There is more (even more if we include other Hindu text like the Manu, floods and tempting snakes and stuff) but there is no denying the similarities between the Hindu Bhagavad Gita and the New Testament.

Of course, the Bhagavad Gita is much older text than the New Testament.

So what are the possibilities here?

1. The New Testament borrows some of the Hindu text to create its version of the story.
2. Krishna and Jesus are the same deity who came to the world twice as god-incarnate.
3. Coincidence that the writers came up with similar stories hundreds of years apart.

I think is logical to conclude that the New Testament borrows some of the Hindu text to create its version of the story.

 

[insidejob]

1.

Christ spent his lost years from 12-33 spending time in India first mastering Hinduism (he mastered it but thought they were too into the rituals and not enough the actual spiritual practice) and then Buddhism which he took the pieces he liked and left the rest behind to create Christianity. It's also how the Catholics have all their patron saints like Hindus do a god for everything.

I spent a bit of time on this and read everything I could find on the "Lost Years of Saint Issa" (That's what the Buddhist monks called him. Issa translates to Jesus.)

The Bhagavad Gita is my favorite spiritual text. Arjuna's lessons taught to him for battle are applicable to life in general.

 

[Booker]

1.

Christ spent his lost years from 12-33 spending time in India first mastering Hinduism (he mastered it but thought they were too into the rituals and not enough the actual spiritual practice) and then Buddhism which he took the pieces he liked and left the rest behind to create Christianity. It's also how the Catholics have all their patron saints like Hindus do a god for everything.

I spent a bit of time on this and read everything I could find on the "Lost Years of Saint Issa" (That's what the Buddhist monks called him. Issa translates to Jesus.)

The Bhagavad Gita is my favorite spiritual text. Arjuna's lessons taught to him for battle are applicable to life in general.

For what it's worth, the whole Jesus in India "Issa" thing is acknowledged as a hoax all started by Nicolas Notovich in the late 19th century. The supposed manuscripts his story was based off of appear to be about as historical as Joseph Smith’s golden plates. Other writers have since tried to capitalize off the story, but I see no reason to view it as anything more than fan fiction.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nicolas_Notovitch

Notovitch's book generated controversy as soon as it was published. The philologist Max Müller expressed incredulity at the account presented and suggested that either Notovitch was the victim of a practical joke or he had fabricated the evidence.[10][11] Müller wrote: "Taking it for granted that M. Notovitch is a gentleman and not a liar, we cannot help thinking that the Buddhist monks of Ladakh and Tibet must be wags, who enjoy mystifying inquisitive travelers, and that M. Notovitch fell far too easy a victim to their jokes."[4] Müller then wrote to the head lama at Hemis monastery to ask about the document and Notovitch's story. The head lama replied that there had been no western visitor at the monastery in the previous fifteen years, during which he had been the head lama there, and there were no documents related to Notovitch's story.[4][12] Other European scholars also opposed Notovitch's account and Indologist Leopold von Schroeder called Notovitch's story a "big fat lie".[4]

J. Archibald Douglas, who was a professor of English and History at the Government College in Agra, then visited the Hemis monastery to interview the head lama, who stated yet again that Notovitch had never been there and that no such documents existed.[12] Wilhelm Schneemelcher states that Notovich's accounts were soon exposed as fabrications, and that to date no one has even had a glimpse at the manuscripts Notovitch claims to have seen.[5] Notovich at first responded to claims to defend himself.[13] But once his story had been re-examined by historians, Notovitch is said to have confessed to having fabricated the evidence.[4]

It’s a whole other discussion, but the interesting truth is that there are a grand total of zero first person accounts of Jesus anywhere on earth, nor even any contemporary third person accounts.

 

[Booker]

Be assured that he who worships me, perishes not.
He that believeth in me shall never perish, but shall have eternal life.

I am the beginning and the middle and the end of things.
I am Alpha, Omega, the beginning and the ending.

God incarnated, born to a virgin mother, persecuted by the King, who orders all newborns killed.
God incarnated, born to a virgin mother, persecuted by the King, who orders all newborns killed.

There is more (even more if we include other Hindu text like the Manu, floods and tempting snakes and stuff) but there is no denying the similarities between the Hindu Bhagavad Gita and the New Testament.

Of course, the Bhagavad Gita is much older text than the New Testament.

So what are the possibilities here?

1. The New Testament borrows some of the Hindu text to create its version of the story.
2. Krishna and Jesus are the same deity who came to the world twice as god-incarnate.
3. Coincidence that the writers came up with similar stories hundreds of years apart.

I think is logical to conclude that the New Testament borrows some of the Hindu text to create its version of the story.

Zoroastrianism is known to have influenced Judaism and later Christianity, so I don’t think a similar adoption of some Hindu concepts is too far out of the box. Definitely seems more plausible than the other options.

 

[Booker]

So is anyone familiar with Inanna? Also later known as Ishtar. She was an ancient Mesopotamian goddess who was worshiped at least as far back as 4000-5000 years ago.

Inanna - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Anyway, one of the more interesting stories about Inanna was her descent into the underworld. She passed through a series of gates, with clothes removed as she passed through each one until she's naked. Seven judges then condemned her to death, and her corpse was hung up on a nail where she remained dead for three days and three nights before being resurrected. This story predates the New Testament by several millennia.

What about Dionysus, also known as Bacchus? He predates Christianity by a millennia, give or take. He is generally known as the god of wine (the OG when it came to turning water to wine), but was also the god of the harvest (i.e. bread). One of his myths tells that he was killed, dismembered and eaten by the Titans, but was later resurrected. His followers engaged in rituals where they ate bread (or sometimes raw flesh) and drank wine as a symbolic communion with their god.

Dionysus - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[Booker]

Continuing with the theme of outside influences on the development of Christianity, the Inanna story has an interesting parallel with the early Christian document The Ascension of Isaiah. The Ascension of Isaiah is generally dated from the late first century to the early second century (around the same time the canonical Gospels were being written), but it was tinkered with here and there to varying degrees between when it was originally written and the surviving versions we have.

Anyway, the document is made up of two separate works that were written at different times, The Martyrdom of Isaiah and The Vision of Isaiah. The Vision of Isaiah, beginning with Chapter 6 in the link below, is where things get interesting.

The Ascension of Isaiah

The Ascension of Isaiah. On Early Christian Writings.

www.earlychristianwritings.com

In the Vision, Isaiah ascends through the seven heavens until he reaches the seventh heaven "where dwelleth He that is not named and the Elect One, whose name has not been made known, and none of the heavens can learn His name." He learns this secret Elect One who has yet been unrevealed is "the Lord Christ, who will be called "Jesus" in the world, but His name thou canst not hear till thou hast ascended out of thy body," and that he is worshiped by the other angels.

Just as Inanna descends through seven gates of hell, is killed, hung on a nail and then resurrected after three days and nights, Isaiah is told that Jesus is to disguise himself as a human and descend through the gates of the seven heavens, where he will be killed, hung on a tree, and then ascend on the third day back to the seventh heaven.

13. Nevertheless they see and know whose will be thrones, and whose the crowns when He has descended and been made in your form, and they will think that He is flesh and is a man.

14. And the god of that world will stretch forth his hand against the Son, and they will crucify Him on a tree, and will slay Him not knowing who He is.

15. And thus His descent, as you will see, will be hidden even from the heavens, so that it will not be known who He is.

16. And when He hath plundered the angel of death, He will ascend on the third day...

The interesting thing here is that just as Inanna is slain by the gods of the underworld, "the god of that world" that is to slay Jesus is in fact Satan. Even more interesting, this and other elements actually bear much in common with elements of the Pauline epistles found in the Bible (which of course predate the Gospel narratives):

- Paul speaks of Jesus being hung on a tree (Galatians 3:13 " 13 Christ did redeem us from the curse of the law, having become for us a curse, for it hath been written, `Cursed is every one who is hanging on a tree,'").

- He speaks of Jesus being slain in secret by the "Rulers of this Age," understood to mean Satan and his minions (1 Corinthians 2:7-8 "7 but we speak the hidden wisdom of God in a secret, that God foreordained before the ages to our glory, 8 which no one of the rulers of this age did know, for if they had known, the Lord of the glory they would not have crucified")

- He speaks of "a man in Christ" (himself, but he's trying not to boast) who traveled up and witnessed the third heaven (2 Corinthians 12:2 "2 I have known a man in Christ, fourteen years ago -- whether in the body I have not known, whether out of the body I have not known, God hath known -- such an one being caught away unto the third heaven.")

So it's likely that either Paul was familiar with this story or that the author of this story was familiar with the Pauline epistles and reflected some common beliefs. Either way, there are some interesting parallels with the mythology of Inanna that suggest derivation.