Law be damned, Trump asserts unilateral control over executive branch, federal service (2 Viewers)

[superchuck500]

Following the Project 2025 playbook, in the last week, Trump and his newly installed loyalists have moved to (1) dismiss federal officials deemed unreliable to do his bidding (including 17 inspectors general) - many of which have protections from arbitrary dismissal, (2) freeze all science and public health activity until he can wrest full control, (3) freeze all federal assistance and grant activity deemed inconsistent with Trump's agenda, and (4) moved to terminate all federal employee telework and DEI programs.

The problem is much of this is controlled by federal law and not subject to sudden and complete change by the president through executive order. Most notably is the Impoundment Control Act of 1974 that simply codifies what is the constitutional allocation of resources where Congress appropriates money to the executive branch for a specific purpose, the executive branch must carry out that statutory purpose. This is indeed a constitutional crisis and even if Congress abdicates to Trump by acquiescing, the courts must still apply the law - or rule it unconstitutional.

And meanwhile the architect of much of this unlawful action is Russell Vought, Trump’s OMB nominee who the Senate appears ready to confirm.

120. The Impoundment Crisis of 2025

The Trump administration's Monday spending freeze is likely to provoke a crisis over the constitutionality of "impoundment"—one that the justices could well have to resolve *very* soon.

www.stevevladeck.com

 

[Optimus Prime]

You say Congress hasn’t held itself responsible and then you ask why Republicans aren’t doing that which Democrats wouldn’t do either. I don’t believe for a second that if this were Biden and Soros for example, that Democrats would behave differently. They would not. They would circle the wagons and make the same excuses.

Man is that doing some heavy lifting

A. Biden or Harris wouldn’t do anything remotely as close to what Trump and Musk have done

B. IF they did I disagree that the Democrats would act as blindly and cowardly as the GOP has

C. Dems forced their elderly sometimes rambling sometime gaffe making candidate out of the presidential race. GOP stood by while Trump daily lies and said all kinds of crazy shirt and said and did nothing

D. If the Dems did the same thing there’s no way you shrug your shoulders and say “oh well, both sides do the same thing. GOP should win more elections”

E. And MAGA has already tried to peddle a similar line of bullshirt “If Obama did Jan 6th y’all wouldn’t have impeached him either!”

No. If, after losing himself in 2012 or after Hillary lost he had done what Trump did after 2020, not only would Obama have been impeached, the Senators and Congress reps who spent months online and on TV repeating the lie os election fraud and fanning the flame of a stolen election would first get removed from any committees they were on. Then would be forced to resign, or would get primaries or just lose in the general.

And despite the course correcting, the self policing and the distancing and disavowing I strongly believe if Obama had done a Jan 6th you wouldn’t see a democrat elected president again for at least a dozen years

 

[TampaJoe]

Nobody but nobody said this. You consistently put up straw men like this and then try to invent straw men to use against me. I have consistently pointed out that this isn’t hearsay: there are some very troubling things happening that have never happened before.

What you and Sendai are doing is ignoring clear abuses of power like this country has never seen before. Because it’s “your team” abusing power? I don’t know but I’m reaching that conclusion.

Joe acts like Biden did a whole bunch of unethical things with zero proof but wants to accept that Trump isn’t doing anything unprecedented with blind faith when his crap is being done out in the open.

Bad faith posting all around.

So you say I have no proof. Okay. Where is your proof? I haven’t seen “proof”. I’ve seen allegations but no proof. You think because you post a link to a news story that is “proof”. It isn’t.

So if you have some actual proof, sworn statements from actual witnesses, then please post that.

 

[fooferdoggie]

This is supposed to be an independent federal agency established by law. Trump can't unilaterally shut them down can he? I'm trying to figure out how he can do this.

And if anyone thinks this isn't Trump, remember the director is doing Trump's bidding.

Congress has to step in here, but they're sitting there twiddling their thumbs while the government burns.

Fork every Republican enabling this nonsense.

the GOP has wanted this gone forever so of course they will not do anything. They love those payday loan places.

 

[TampaJoe]

Excuses, excuses is all I'm hearing from you. Keep carrying that water.

Also, I'm done with this. I feel like I'm talking to a wall. I'd rather debate with someone who's willing to, in good faith, call out current nonsense when they see it instead of making excuses for it.

If you want me to say that examining federal spending is “nonsense”, you will be waiting a while. I have already said I think that is a good idea and highly overdue. I get you don’t like or agree with that and you believe it can be done internally. I disagree.

As for illegality or ethical breeches, as I said earlier I dont take any unsubstantiated claim made at face value. They are often not accurate.

 

[TampaJoe]

Man is that doing some heavy lifting

A. Biden or Harris wouldn’t do anything remotely as close to what Trump and Musk have done

B. IF they did I disagree that the Democrats would act as blindly and cowardly as the GOP has

C. Dems forced their elderly sometimes rambling sometime gaffe making candidate out of the presidential race. GOP stood by while Trump daily lies and said all kinds of crazy shirt and said and did nothing

D. If the Dems did the same thing there’s no way you shrug your shoulders and say “oh well, both sides do the same thing. GOP should win more elections”

That’s BS. If Biden hadn’t performed so poorly in the debate, he wouldn’t have been forced out. He was forced out when it became apparent Dems couldn’t continue to gaslight the voters and that was showing up in the polls. Otherwise he wouldn’t have stayed in the race and you would have gleefully voted for him.

I doubt you had any issues with any of Biden’s EO’s. If so, which ones?

 

[RobF]

If you want me to say that examining federal spending is “nonsense”, you will be waiting a while. I have already said I think that is a good idea and highly overdue. I get you don’t like or agree with that and you believe it can be done internally. I disagree.

As for illegality or ethical breeches, as I said earlier I dont take any unsubstantiated claim made at face value. They are often not accurate.

Literally Musk: "I spent the weekend feeding USAID into the chipper!"

Joe: "No, he's just 'examining federal spending'."

Embarrassing.

 

[DaveXA]

Literally Musk: "I spent the weekend feeding USAID into the chipper!"

Joe: "No, he's just 'examining federal spending'."

Embarrassing.

But, but duh Demucwats...gah!

Embarrassing indeed.

 

[DJ1BigTymer]

If you want me to say that examining federal spending is “nonsense”, you will be waiting a while.

That is why the inspector generals exists! Normal federal spending is governed by Congress, if you disagree with that spending, then you take it up with congress.
THAT IS HOW DEMOCRACY WORKS.

Trump can't issue decrees or orders to eliminate agencies that he and his cronies doesn't like. DOING SO, UNDERMINES DEMOCRACY!!!

If their true concern was about Fraud, Waste & Abuse, then why did trump fire the IGs? That was their job!

No, their reasoning behind these actions are ideological and because of that, their reasoning should be brought before Congress, not an unelected entity!

 

[Neworleansfan]

And now Trump is shutting down the Consumer Financial Protection Bureau. So, no more oversight to make sure banks and lenders aren’t ripping off customers.

Consumer Financial Protection Bureau is ordered by acting director to stop fighting financial abuse | CNN Business

Russell Vought, the newly installed acting director of the Consumer Financial Protection Bureau, sent an email Saturday night ordering all employees at the consumer watchdog to stop virtually all work — including fighting financial abuse.

www.cnn.com

Another financial crisis and government bailed out coming in a near future.

 

[fooferdoggie]

Another financial crisis and government bailed out coming in a near future.

I doubt a government bailout not with a clown in charge.

 

[Neworleansfan]

I doubt a government bailout not with a clown in charge.

Corporations bailed out.

 

[fooferdoggie]

Corporations bailed out.

only if they follow project 2025.

 

[J-DONK]

You say Congress hasn’t held itself responsible and then you ask why Republicans aren’t doing that which Democrats wouldn’t do either. I don’t believe for a second that if this were Biden and Soros for example, that Democrats would behave differently. They would not. They would circle the wagons and make the same excuses.

Biden and Schumer, one a sitting Senator and one an ex Senator have been on both sides of just about every issue. The filibuster for example. They are for it when it benefits them and against it when it doesn’t. So until both sides decide to have one set of rules applied consistently regardless of party, this won’t change.

FYI: You ratted yourself out on this one. Soros is only the boogeyman to conseratives, and you have to consume that content to believe that.



Here is a list for 2024. The only Democrats on the list are in 8th, and 9th place:

2024 Top Donors to Outside Spending Groups

www.opensecrets.org

Rank	Donor	Total	To Conservs	To Liberals	% to Conservs	% to Liberals
1	Mellon, Timothy Investor Saratoga	$197,003,300	$172,000,000	$0	100.0%	0.0%
2	Uihlein, Richard & Elizabeth Uline Inc Lake Forest	$133,800,891	$133,800,891	$0	100.0%	0.0%
3	Musk, Elon SpaceX Austin	$132,714,600	$132,714,600	$0	100.0%	0.0%
4	Adelson, Miriam O. Adelson Clinic for Drug Abuse Treatment & Research Las Vegas	$132,395,000	$132,395,000	$0	100.0%	0.0%
5	Griffin, Kenneth C. Citadel LLC Chicago	$100,000,000	$100,000,000	$0	100.0%	0.0%
6	Yass, Jeffrey S & Janine Susquehanna International Group Bala Cynwyd	$95,968,281	$95,168,281	$0	100.0%	0.0%
7	Singer, Paul E. Elliott Management New York	$58,650,000	$56,650,000	$0	100.0%	0.0%
8	Bloomberg, Michael R. City of New York, NY New York	$46,076,784	$1,000,000	$42,576,784	2.3%	97.7%
9	Tuna, Cari Asana San Francisco	$38,000,000	$0	$38,000,000	0.0%	100.0%
10	Schwarzman, Stephen A. Blackstone Group New York	$36,175,000	$36,175,000	$0	100.0%	0.0%

Also, why no one should believe a single word from Elon:

 

[DaveXA]

FYI: You ratted yourself out on this one. Soros is only the boogeyman to conseratives, and you have to consume that content to believe that.



Here is a list for 2024. The only Democrats on the list are in 8th, and 9th place:

2024 Top Donors to Outside Spending Groups

www.opensecrets.org

Rank	Donor	Total	To Conservs	To Liberals	% to Conservs	% to Liberals
1	Mellon, Timothy Investor Saratoga	$197,003,300	$172,000,000	$0	100.0%	0.0%
2	Uihlein, Richard & Elizabeth Uline Inc Lake Forest	$133,800,891	$133,800,891	$0	100.0%	0.0%
3	Musk, Elon SpaceX Austin	$132,714,600	$132,714,600	$0	100.0%	0.0%
4	Adelson, Miriam O. Adelson Clinic for Drug Abuse Treatment & Research Las Vegas	$132,395,000	$132,395,000	$0	100.0%	0.0%
5	Griffin, Kenneth C. Citadel LLC Chicago	$100,000,000	$100,000,000	$0	100.0%	0.0%
6	Yass, Jeffrey S & Janine Susquehanna International Group Bala Cynwyd	$95,968,281	$95,168,281	$0	100.0%	0.0%
7	Singer, Paul E. Elliott Management New York	$58,650,000	$56,650,000	$0	100.0%	0.0%
8	Bloomberg, Michael R. City of New York, NY New York	$46,076,784	$1,000,000	$42,576,784	2.3%	97.7%
9	Tuna, Cari Asana San Francisco	$38,000,000	$0	$38,000,000	0.0%	100.0%
10	Schwarzman, Stephen A. Blackstone Group New York	$36,175,000	$36,175,000	$0	100.0%	0.0%

Yep, pretty clear who butters who's bread.

 

[MT15]

That is why the inspector generals exists! Normal federal spending is governed by Congress, if you disagree with that spending, then you take it up with congress.
THAT IS HOW DEMOCRACY WORKS.

Trump can't issue decrees or orders to eliminate agencies that he and his cronies doesn't like. DOING SO, UNDERMINES DEMOCRACY!!!

If their true concern was about Fraud, Waste & Abuse, then why did trump fire the IGs? That was their job!

No, their reasoning behind these actions are ideological and because of that, their reasoning should be brought before Congress, not an unelected entity!

This is what is being completely ignored by our resident “conservatives”. Highly irregular activity by a person who gets millions upon millions of dollars from the federal government, unelected stooges seizing control of government agencies and boasting they have disbanded them. All in violation of the Constitution surely and probably the law as well.

 

[DaveXA]

This is what is being completely ignored by our resident “conservatives”. Highly irregular activity by a person who gets millions upon millions of dollars from the federal government, unelected stooges seizing control of government agencies and boasting they have disbanded them. All in violation of the Constitution surely and probably the law as well.

Thank you for putting the "conservatives" in quotes because MAGA/Trumpers and those supporting their agenda aren't conservative at all.

 

[Neworleansfan]

the GOP has wanted this gone forever so of course they will not do anything. They love those payday loan places.

Subprime mortgages, banks and corporations taking more chances. Then another banking and corporate bailout using taxpayer dollars like 2008 and 2011 while the rest of us left holding the bags.

 

[Sendai]

This is what is being completely ignored by our resident “conservatives”. Highly irregular activity by a person who gets millions upon millions of dollars from the federal government, unelected stooges seizing control of government agencies and boasting they have disbanded them. All in violation of the Constitution surely and probably the law as well.

Not ignoring.

Seems to me it’s more of a highly unique and rather in depth audit of federal agencies. And I admit to being curious as to what the audit discloses.

And it could end up being a bust.