Dishonesty in Research: A Growing Problem, or Growing Awareness of a Problem Long Existing? (1 Viewer)

[Snarky Sack]

Keep in mind that academic journals who peer review research articles before they publish them have no way to check on the honesty of the researchers. The experiments, surveys and other data gathering procedures have already been done, and the only record of them are those produced by the researchers who write the articles.

The exception to that might be meta studies, which look at a number of articles by other researchers in order to identify trends. But even for those, the meta-researcher cannot check the honesty of every piece of research that they examine.

Can you trust a Harvard dishonesty researcher?

The hard problem of faked data in science.

www.vox.com

My point is not that we should never believe research. It is that there is no reason to always believe research. When we are presented with purported proof of some political point that is based on research, we need to examine the research with some skepticism. If it doesn't pass the laugh test, the common sense test, and the "who paid for this" test, we should look at it with a lot of skepticism.

 

[Bigdaddysaints]

I am not sure if i should trust research that is about not trusting research...

 

[DaveXA]

Keep in mind that academic journals who peer review research articles before they publish them have no way to check on the honesty of the researchers. The experiments, surveys and other data gathering procedures have already been done, and the only record of them are those produced by the researchers who write the articles.

The exception to that might be meta studies, which look at a number of articles by other researchers in order to identify trends. But even for those, the meta-researcher cannot check the honesty of every piece of research that they examine.

Can you trust a Harvard dishonesty researcher?

The hard problem of faked data in science.

www.vox.com

My point is not that we should never believe research. It is that there is no reason to always believe research. When we are presented with purported proof of some political point that is based on research, we need to examine the research with some skepticism. If it doesn't pass the laugh test, the common sense test, and the "who paid for this" test, we should look at it with a lot of skepticism.

This just feels like an attempt to make people question all research, and science and legitimate critical thinking.

And of course one shouldn't believe everything they read. Sorta like we'll, it's on the internet so it must be true sentiment.

 

[Snarky Sack]

This just feels like an attempt to make people question all research,

it is.

and science and legitimate critical thinking.

Questioning science is not a bad thing. Questioning science is exactly how you do science. Critical thinking is required to question science and research.

And of course one shouldn't believe everything they read. Sorta like we'll, it's on the internet so it must be true sentiment.

Kee-rect.

 

[Bigdaddysaints]

Questioning science is not a bad thing. Questioning science is exactly how you do science. Critical thinking is required to question science and research.

There is a difference in questioning science and ignoring/disregarding science, which happened A LOT during Covid.

 

[samiam5211]

Nothing is perfect.

We should still trust the "experts" over anyone else.

 

[Snarky Sack]

There is a difference in questioning science and ignoring/disregarding science, which happened A LOT during Covid.

It sure did!

Like the forced wearing of masks, which was based on no science at all. Fauci himself said that they would be ineffective, until he made the science-free decision to promote mandatory mask wear for all.

Or the statement that if you get the vaccine, you don't have to wear a mask anymore. I fell for that one, and it lasted what? A week. It wasn't science, it was science-free public policy making.

Of course that was not about fraudulent research, because there was no research at all backing up mask wear for healthy people out in public as a way to prevent the spread of COVID.

But danged if it didn't make it look like we were doing something. Like Gerald Ford's "Whip Inflation Now" (WIN) buttons.

 

[Bigdaddysaints]

It sure did!

Like the forced wearing of masks, which was based on no science at all. Fauci himself said that they would be ineffective, until he made the science-free decision to promote mandatory mask wear for all.

Or the statement that if you get the vaccine, you don't have to wear a mask anymore. I fell for that one, and it lasted what? A week. It wasn't science, it was science-free public policy making.

Of course that was not about fraudulent research, because there was no research at all backing up mask wear for healthy people out in public as a way to prevent the spread of COVID.

But danged if it didn't make it look like we were doing something. Like Gerald Ford's "Whip Inflation Now" (WIN) buttons.

more like the shedding of the vaccine, Covid was fake, transmitted through 5G, drinking bleach, gov't faking death certificates.. I could go on and on.
You can talk about the mask thing, but there is plenty of research that does show they work. Just ask any one who needs surgery, they'd be mad if the Dr isn't wearing a mask, no one ever claimed masks were 100% effective. but to say they weren't effective at all is just ignorance.

 

[DaveXA]

more like the shedding of the vaccine, Covid was fake, transmitted through 5G, drinking bleach, gov't faking death certificates.. I could go on and on.
You can talk about the mask thing, but there is plenty of research that does show they work. Just ask any one who needs surgery, they'd be mad if the Dr isn't wearing a mask, no one ever claimed masks were 100% effective. but to say they weren't effective at all is just ignorance.

His entire post reeks of ignorance.

 

[MT15]

It sure did!

Like the forced wearing of masks, which was based on no science at all. Fauci himself said that they would be ineffective, until he made the science-free decision to promote mandatory mask wear for all.

Or the statement that if you get the vaccine, you don't have to wear a mask anymore. I fell for that one, and it lasted what? A week. It wasn't science, it was science-free public policy making.

Of course that was not about fraudulent research, because there was no research at all backing up mask wear for healthy people out in public as a way to prevent the spread of COVID.

But danged if it didn't make it look like we were doing something. Like Gerald Ford's "Whip Inflation Now" (WIN) buttons.

Fact free as usual.

Twisting things around to support a narrative that is one reason the US had the absolute worst death rate among similar nations.

As time goes by, and the magnitude of needless deaths becomes more apparent, people who pushed these conspiracy theories and people who believed them will get the majority of the blame. Trump will go down as one of the worst presidential responses to a public health crisis in our history.

 

[Snarky Sack]

more like the shedding of the vaccine, Covid was fake, transmitted through 5G, drinking bleach, gov't faking death certificates.. I could go on and on.

You sure could and people often do, even though that was a tiny minority of people.

A bigger group questioned why we shut down the economy, restricted our freedoms and damaged our children's education based on the guesswork of a few senior officials who provided no science. Those who questioned those things were accused of "ignoring science."

You can talk about the mask thing, but there is plenty of research that does show they work. Just ask any one who needs surgery, they'd be mad if the Dr isn't wearing a mask, no one ever claimed masks were 100% effective. but to say they weren't effective at all is just ignorance.

What new research about mask wearing was done between the time falchi told us we shouldn't be wearing masks and the time he announced that we should all be wearing masks, as long as they were homemade from Fruit of the Loom t-shirts?

The answer is none of course. All the research done after people started doing that showed that such homemade t-shirts had no identifiable significant effect on slowing the spread of the virus. But they were a cool fashion statement as well as a way to Virtue signal.

And of course there were always the Wise Guys that had logos on their mask indicating how stupid it was to wear a mask. So I guess up part kind of defeated the purpose.

 

[DaveXA]

You sure could and people often do, even though that was a tiny minority of people.

A bigger group questioned why we shut down the economy, restricted our freedoms and damaged our children's education based on the guesswork of a few senior officials who provided no science. Those who questioned those things were accused of "ignoring science."

What new research about mask wearing was done between the time falchi told us we shouldn't be wearing masks and the time he announced that we should all be wearing masks, as long as they were homemade from Fruit of the Loom t-shirts?

The answer is none of course. All the research done after people started doing that showed that such homemade t-shirts had no identifiable significant effect on slowing the spread of the virus. But they were a cool fashion statement as well as a way to Virtue signal.

And of course there were always the Wise Guys that had logos on their mask indicating how stupid it was to wear a mask. So I guess up part kind of defeated the purpose.

All of this has been debated to death in multiple Covid threads. No need to waste time debunking your nonsense.

 

[Snarky Sack]

All of this has been debated to death in multiple Covid threads. No need to waste time debunking your nonsense.

Yet you have time to tell me that you have no time to waste on my, as well as time to track down what was apparently the most racist meme .gif that you could find? Did you literally search on "racist .gif?"

It was Bid Daddy Saints who brought up COVID, not me.

 

[samiam5211]

You sure could and people often do, even though that was a tiny minority of people.

A bigger group questioned why we shut down the economy, restricted our freedoms and damaged our children's education based on the guesswork of a few senior officials who provided no science. Those who questioned those things were accused of "ignoring science."

What new research about mask wearing was done between the time falchi told us we shouldn't be wearing masks and the time he announced that we should all be wearing masks, as long as they were homemade from Fruit of the Loom t-shirts?

The answer is none of course. All the research done after people started doing that showed that such homemade t-shirts had no identifiable significant effect on slowing the spread of the virus. But they were a cool fashion statement as well as a way to Virtue signal.

And of course there were always the Wise Guys that had logos on their mask indicating how stupid it was to wear a mask. So I guess up part kind of defeated the purpose.

What was their end game by making us wear masks?

 

[Bigdaddysaints]

What was their end game by making us wear masks?

AUTHORITARIAN CONTROL! THEY DID IT JUST TO MAKE US COMPLY! SHEEP! SHEEP!
you didn't get that memo?

 

[Snarky Sack]

What was their end game by making us wear masks?

I wish that I knew. It's easy to ascribe the worst motivations to them, for such a bizarre and unscientific requirement being foisted on us, but I don't believe that they were just simply evil.

I know that in some 3rd world cultures, women are forced to wear masks, and the reason is that they are considered their father's or husband's property, not to be gazed at by other men.

In Japan, it is part of the social etiquette, similar to bowing instead of shaking hands. I suppose on a heavily populated island, they must find ways separate from each other, if only symbolically.

I don't know if either factor was at play with the mask authoritarians. I wonder whether I am trying to find logic among people who simply experienced and promoted a social contagion, and applied no logic.

Whatever it was, it is still having negative effects on children. about five percent of the students in my junior high are still wearing masks. Of that five percent, nearly all are girls. The reason they give: "I don't like the way I look." The students with mental disorders that I work with are over-represented among persistent mask wearers.

We have one student who wears feminine clothes, including dresses occasionally, identifies as "the boy who wears dresses," and he wears masks also. We have several biological females who wear masculine clothes and "date" girls at school and not one of them wears a mask. I don't know what to read into any of that. Research is needed on the harmful effects that the mask mandates had, but I doubt it will ever be done, or peer-reviewed.

 

[samiam5211]

I wish that I knew. It's easy to ascribe the worst motivations to them, for such a bizarre and unscientific requirement being foisted on us, but I don't believe that they were just simply evil.

I know that in some 3rd world cultures, women are forced to wear masks, and the reason is that they are considered their father's or husband's property, not to be gazed at by other men.

In Japan, it is part of the social etiquette, similar to bowing instead of shaking hands. I suppose on a heavily populated island, they must find ways separate from each other, if only symbolically.

I don't know if either factor was at play with the mask fascists. I wonder whether I am trying to find logic among people who simply experienced and promoted a social contagion, and applied no logic.

Whatever it was, it is still having negative effects on children. about five percent of the students in my junior high are still wearing masks. Of that five percent, nearly all are girls. The reason they give: "I don't like the way I look." The students with mental disorders that I work with are over-represented among persistent mask wearers.

We have one student who wears feminine clothes, including dresses occasionally, identifies as "the boy who wears dresses," and he wears masks also. We have several biological females who wear masculine clothes and "date" girls at school and not one of them wears a mask. I don't know what to read into any of that. Research is needed on the harmful effects that the mask mandates had, but I doubt it will ever be done, or peer-reviewed.

Sorry you wasted time typing out all that nonsense. You are really all over the place.

Masks helped. That is the only reason.

At the time, people like you were claiming that they were never going to let us stop masking. Once that clearly wasn't true, you guys should have just dropped all the anti-mask nonsense, but you can't let it go.

It just makes you look like an idiot, just let it go man.

 

[DaveXA]

Yet you have time to tell me that you have no time to waste on my, as well as time to track down what was apparently the most racist meme .gif that you could find? Did you literally search on "racist .gif?"

It was Bid Daddy Saints who brought up COVID, not me.

It's literally the first gif that comes up when searching "nobody got time for dat". It's been used hundreds of times on multiple sites and you're the first person to complain about that. Wonder why that is.

Edit: I even screenshot it for you.