TikTok and China (2 Viewers)

I have a question about TikTok, if there is an ability to “spy” I’m not sure what that means other than the ability to do something like insert false narratives during election time or to blunt valid critiques of China through manipulation by agents of China which btw is a valid concern in all social media, and not just China but all foreign players if they are validly deemed hostile to the US (or apply this standard to any country on either end of the issue, as manipulator or manipulated).

For the former, ”spying” , I would think that programming experts would be able dissect the software and find the ability to spy, but for the latter which is a valid concern I am more sympathetic to the idea of banning China if there is a history of false narratives favorable to China, or detrimental to US elections being used to manipulate the sheep.

I dont know enough about tech to really know exactly how TikTok would be "spying" other than its some sort of spyware that tracks location/keystrokes/sites visited and looks for keywords that widdle down the MILLIONS of users to those deemed "useful"

Then maybe audio/video recordings remotely?

I think the case for shutting it down has more to do with the exposure level.

Allowing a Chinese Government entity the ability to record data from millions of Americans is enough to give pause for sure.

Then there is the theory that allowing them to control the algorithms, and ultimately manipulate what content Americans (especially kids who are the largest user of the site) view can have some tangible and unknown societal impacts- basically a massive, uncontrolled social experiment.

I read an article about how the content that children in their country see is education based and having families.

Our kids get dumbed down content, showing decadence and leisure

I don’t pretend to know enough about data mining to know if that article is accurate or fear porn but tend to think (hope?) the latter.

I know my daughters use the hell out of that site. They seem fine.

CoolBrees said:

I think the case for shutting it down has more to do with the exposure level.

Allowing a Chinese Government entity the ability to record data from millions of Americans is enough to give pause for sure.

Then there is the theory that allowing them to control the algorithms, and ultimately manipulate what content Americans (especially kids who are the largest user of the site) view can have some tangible and unknown societal impacts- basically a massive, uncontrolled social experiment.

I read an article about how the content that children in their country see is education based and having families.

Our kids get dumbed down content, showing decadence and leisure

I don’t pretend to know enough about data mining to know if that article is accurate or fear porn but tend to think (hope?) the latter.

I know my daughters use the hell out of that site. They seem fine.

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Putting the Chinese government concerns to the side for a second, what's the difference in the type of content that kids/people get on TikTok as opposed to any other social media app?

Me and my 16-year old don't use TikTok, but my partner is always on it. Most of the post that he shows me from there is the same crap I've seen on Facebook Reels. As I understand it, it's mostly used by millennials now.

coldseat said:

Putting the Chinese government concerns to the side for a second, what's the difference in the type of content that kids/people get on TikTok as opposed to any other social media app?

Me and my 16-year old don't use TikTok, but my partner is always on it. Most of the post that he shows me from there is the same crap I've seen on Facebook Reels. As I understand it, it's mostly used by millennials now.

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No I don’t think they show anything different, that is why I think the article was fear porn.

I don’t use anything but SaintsReport so I am worthless on what is on it.

anonymous member said:

I have a question about TikTok, if there is an ability to “spy” I’m not sure what that means other than the ability to do something like insert false narratives during election time or to blunt valid critiques of China through manipulation by agents of China which btw is a valid concern in all social media, and not just China but all foreign players if they are validly deemed hostile to the US (or apply this standard to any country on either end of the issue, as manipulator or manipulated).

For the former, ”spying” , I would think that programming experts would be able dissect the software and find the ability to spy, but for the latter which is a valid concern I am more sympathetic to the idea of banning China if there is a history of false narratives favorable to China, or detrimental to US elections being used to manipulate the sheep.

Is TikTok getting banned? CEO in for 'tough fight' defending Chinese ownership on Capitol Hill

TikTok CEO Shou Zi Chew is headed to Capitol Hill for a political showdown over the fate of the popular short-form video app. Will TikTok be banned?

finance.yahoo.com

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The accusation has been made that the software is being used to track journalists…to silence dissent, I suppose in Chins or everywhere?

The hearing yesterday was pathetic. They were so all in on "China, China, China", they weren't really concerned about privacy, they only cared about making a show about being tough on China.

Every time the TicTok guy tried to explain that they weren't doing anything that other social media companies weren't doing, they would shut him down and bring up the CCP.

I do hope they ban TicTok, but only because i would support them just getting rid of all social media. The bad far outweighs the good. Social media is cancer.

We shouldn't really care if it's Mark Zuckerberg or Xi abusing our children's privacy, or poisoning them with targeted ads or radicalizing them and destroying their mental health with algorithms.

samiam5211 said:

The hearing yesterday was pathetic. They were so all in on "China, China, China", they weren't really concerned about privacy, they only cared about making a show about being tough on China.

Every time the TicTok guy tried to explain that they weren't doing anything that other social media companies weren't doing, they would shut him down and bring up the CCP.

I do hope they ban TicTok, but only because i would support them just getting rid of all social media. The bad far outweighs the good. Social media is cancer.

We shouldn't really care if it's Mark Zuckerberg or Xi abusing our children's privacy, or poisoning them with targeted ads or radicalizing them and destroying their mental health with algorithms.

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The big concern for the government is that China could easily influence opinions via feed manipulation. I'm not sure the data really matters. Tencent is a Chinese mobile game company that collects a massive amount of data.

The government should do more to protect data, and pass something like the GDPR. That's probably a long ways off though.

I don't feel bad for China though. They are not an open market. They don't allow foreign companies. Their protest should be falling on deaf ears.

This has suddenly become a really interesting issue. Congress is banning something in the ‘land of the free’ without ever having made a case to the public (who are skeptical) - much of it seems like the US tech-giant interests have the fix in. That could even be why they’re so groveling over Trump right now.

But Trump is often just more likely to go with the popular route because he feeds off of the applause and can always out-leverage the people he disappoints. He’s already acting like it’s his call - which is crazy because it’s not. There is existing law that the SCOTUS said is valid and goes into effect, so he doesn’t really have discretion but also the whole ban is stupid to begin with and a pretty broad base of people expect him to do something. Inviting the CEO to his VIP section for the inauguration certainly means that he’s trying to make something happen.

I think it’s going to catch a lot of people in government flat-footed - because they don’t have a clear position and they never took the time to develop one. If Trump says there’s a deal and it won’t go into effect (which is legally troubling but will be popular) it causes the “ban commie TikTok” elements of the GOP to be at odds with Trump or change their tune - while forcing the Democrats to have to take up the “ban TikTok” cause or praise Trump for stopping it.

If he doesn’t prevent the ban - and you have to think that Zuckerberg at minimum is pulling hard for the ban to take effect because Reels is well positioned in that space - it will be unpopular and the Democrats will try to seize on it as Trump playing to the oligarchy . . . but does that mean they think he should have acted like an autocrat and canceled the duly-enacted law? Isn’t that the very thing they’ve been so insistent is bad?

It’s all very twisted up - the next few days of this will be very interesting and probably revealing. As much as I think the stage is set for Trump to take action, I’m concerned about the legality of that kind of thing and what it may embolden in the future.

I started looking a TikTok a few months ago when I found out my daughter was using it. It’s been fine. I haven’t encountered nearly the dubious content I saw on Twitter, for example. It’s fairly easy to make sure it doesn’t show you stuff you’re not interested in.

I’ve seen a lot of entertaining and even some educational stuff. It’s been a great source for recipes that are actually practical, and there’s a whole genre of what I think of as troll recipes which are so stupid they are funny.

Banning it and leaving Twitter, FB, etc, alone is stupid.

Here was the first post in my feed today. Most content is like this in my feed.

J-DONK said:

The big concern for the government is that China could easily influence opinions via feed manipulation. I'm not sure the data really matters. Tencent is a Chinese mobile game company that collects a massive amount of data.

The government should do more to protect data, and pass something like the GDPR. That's probably a long ways off though.

I don't feel bad for China though. They are not an open market. They don't allow foreign companies. Their protest should be falling on deaf ears.

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I’m still amazed that the U.S. government hasn’t implemented something similar to Europe’s GDPR.

Europeans have significantly stronger rights when it comes to protecting their personal information. Meanwhile, people in the U.S., who are otherwise highly protective of their privacy, allow Big Tech and social media platforms to collect and retain far more data than what is permitted under EU regulations.

Also, how does a ban work? At minimum, I suppose there will be no new content. And nobody can download the app. What will happen to those who already have the app on their devices? I assume they cannot reach out and delete them?

My worst fear is that Zuckerberg or Musk will be allowed to buy TikTok. That would be terrible. We know they are bad actors.

MT15 said:

Also, how does a ban work? At minimum, I suppose there will be no new content. And nobody can download the app. What will happen to those who already have the app on their devices? I assume they cannot reach out and delete them?

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The app would still be installed, but wouldn't get updates from the app stores. It may or may not work; if TikTok applied a regional block, or if ISPs blocked connections to it, for example, it may not work without a VPN.

This guy is a chef who has quit his job to move in with his grandmother who is seriously ill. He started making reaction videos to the some of the more silly cooking videos on TikTok. Some language, but he’s a funny guy and I will miss seeing his stuff.

RobF said:

The app would still be installed, but wouldn't get updates from the app stores. It may or may not work; if TikTok applied a regional block, or if ISPs blocked connections to it, for example, it may not work without a VPN.

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I also tried setting my VPN to Albania and it didn’t work.

Create a problem and then blame somebody else. Then "solve" the problem to look like a hero knowing that people are dumb enough to believe it.


I suspect that this was done to lower the value of TikTok so that President Musk can purchase the company at a discount.