All things political. Coronavirus Edition. (17 Viewers)

My brother got Covid recently. He ran a fever over 100F for 10 days and lost 17lbs. He refused to get vaccinated despite my urging months ago. Now he says he might get vaccinated after the antibodies go away. Covid is finally bad enough that it justifies consideration. He wants FDA approval first so he can sue the government if he get vaccine side effects. He also thinks the Delta surge was caused by illegal immigrants.

I hate the idea of mandates, but I’m done with the stupidity. Just end bankruptcy protection and government reimbursement for medical bills due to Covid for anyone unvaccinated. Mandate it for all government employees. Require proof of vaccination to enter government buildings.

B4YOU said:

My brother got Covid recently. He ran a fever over 100F for 10 days and lost 17lbs. He refused to get vaccinated despite my urging months ago. Now he says he might get vaccinated after the antibodies go away. Covid is finally bad enough that it justifies consideration. He wants FDA approval first so he can sue the government if he get vaccine side effects. He also thinks the Delta surge was caused by illegal immigrants.

I hate the idea of mandates, but I’m done with the stupidity. Just end bankruptcy protection and government reimbursement for medical bills due to Covid for anyone unvaccinated. Mandate it for all government employees. Require proof of vaccination to enter government buildings.

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willing to bet that "might" is actually a no. How would he know when the antibodies go away? I think it varies from person to person. And of course every pandemic needs a good scapegoat. And who better to blame than those that do not have a voice to speak out. It sucks that you have family like this. I'd say other than me, my brother and his wife, none of my family is vaccinated and none of them intend on getting it.

coldseat said:

From reading the article, I have a few questions. It says that 40% of the people in the study where over 65, but was that evenly split between Moderna and Pfizer? We know that Pfizer was approved first and first administered to those in nursing homes and over 60. Also, given the release of the two vaccines, were the people in the study that had Pfizer vaccinated longer than the people with Moderna?

I would think those two things would have to be controlled for to have a good comparison and study, but that's not clear in the article.

Also, I wouldn't clasiffy it as Pfizer losing a lot of effectiveness. There was a 10% difference in the two. Certainly no reason to stop administering Pfizer and just go with Moderna.

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Over the course of the whole study, both vaccines did well, but once Delta became dominant in July, Pfizer was down to 40%. Here is the relevant excerpt from the article:

“But what has caused concern is the data from July, when the Delta variant became the dominant strain in the US and accounted for more than 70% of cases in Minnesota.

During that month in Minnesota, Pfizer's effectiveness against COVID-19 infection dropped to 42%, while Moderna's dropped less dramatically to 76%. “

I don’t know how well the study controlled the variables. We’ll see what peer reviews say, since the article says it hasn’t been peer reviewed, but I would expect the Mayo Clinic to do a good job.

That crowd turns on you quickly.

Emerald is a doozy, I think I blocked her on Twitter.

MT15 said:

Emerald is a doozy, I think I blocked her on Twitter.

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oh now I have to go look...

(5 minutes later)

well that was a mistake

So, should we expect Jeff Landry's lawsuit against New Orleans some time on Friday?

Lapaz said:

The poorer effectiveness of the vaccines isn’t uniform. Moderna is still doing well, but Pfizer has lost a lot of its effectiveness. I knew something was wrong based on the data I was seeing reported around the world. We need to narrow down which ones work and move in with those. I saw a report about one of the Russian vaccines being worthless, but the Sputnik is good.

Pfizer's vaccine could be less effective against the Delta variant, study suggests, even though vaccines help prevent serious illness or death

The preprint charted the effectiveness of mRNA vaccines given out in the Mayo Clinic Health System in Minnesota between January and July.

www.google.com

"The Moderna vaccine is likely — very likely — more effective than the Pfizer vaccine in areas where Delta is the dominant strain, and the Pfizer vaccine appears to have a lower durability of effectiveness," Soundararajan told Axios.”

Unfortunately this feeds the anti-Vaxers, but it seems to follow the data.

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I don't know. My experience with the Pfizer vaccine is that while it didn't keep us from getting Covid, it did clearly reduce the severity of our family's cases. 5 of us caught it, and all 5 of us recovered fully within 1-3 days with minor symptoms. 2 unvaccinated in laws remain pretty sick after 14 days.

So somewhat anecdotal, but clearly the Pfizer vaccine made a difference for us.

zztop said:

surprised considering he has been railing against vaccines etc, but not surprising this happened:

Sen. Rand Paul, R-Ky., revealed Wednesday that his wife bought stock in Gilead Sciences - which makes an antiviral drug used to treat the coronavirus - on Feb. 26, 2020, before the threat from covid-19 was fully understood by the public and before it was classified as a pandemic by the World Health Organization.

The disclosure, in a filing with the Senate, came 16 months after the 45-day reporting deadline set forth in the Stock Act, which is designed to combat insider trading.

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Just more evidence Paul is a snake.

I think the number of arrows is inaccurate but the sentiment is still pretty good.

Lapaz said:

Over the course of the whole study, both vaccines did well, but once Delta became dominant in July, Pfizer was down to 40%. Here is the relevant excerpt from the article:

“But what has caused concern is the data from July, when the Delta variant became the dominant strain in the US and accounted for more than 70% of cases in Minnesota.

During that month in Minnesota, Pfizer's effectiveness against COVID-19 infection dropped to 42%, while Moderna's dropped less dramatically to 76%. “

I don’t know how well the study controlled the variables. We’ll see what peer reviews say, since the article says it hasn’t been peer reviewed, but I would expect the Mayo Clinic to do a good job.

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Just a thought, it depends on what effectiveness you're talking about. If the effectiveness is referring to preventing catching Covid/Delta, then the drop-off isn't too surprising. I'm sure the numbers reflect less effectiveness in terms of preventing spread, but, if we're talking effectiveness in preventing serious cases or death, then it remains very effective.

DaveXA said:

I don't know. My experience with the Pfizer vaccine is that while it didn't keep us from getting Covid, it did clearly reduce the severity of our family's cases. 5 of us caught it, and all 5 of us recovered fully within 1-3 days with minor symptoms. 2 unvaccinated in laws remain pretty sick after 14 days.

So somewhat anecdotal, but clearly the Pfizer vaccine made a difference for us.

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Remember that the current trend of concern is related to the Delta variant, but I suspect it could be a variation of that variant. Anyway if you got Covid before July, you probably got a different variant. Nevertheless, I think the vaccine is still doing great preventing hospitalization and death, but I think it is unknown how it is helping with long Covid.

Lapaz said:

Remember that the current trend of concern is related to the Delta variant, but I suspect it could be a variation of that variant. Anyway if you got Covid before July, you probably got a different variant. Nevertheless, I think the vaccine is still doing great preventing hospitalization and death, but I think it is unknown how it is helping with long Covid.

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We got the Delta variant. Started 2 weeks ago as I previously stated and my in laws are still showing symptoms as of today.

As for long Covid, if we only showed symptoms for for a couple of days, then I would assume long Covid is a relative non-factor for those with the vaccine.

DaveXA said:

We got the Delta variant. Started 2 weeks ago as I previously stated and my in laws are still showing symptoms as of today.

As for long Covid, if we only showed symptoms for for a couple of days, then I would assume long Covid is a relative non-factor for those with the vaccine.

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I saw an interview with some doctor who agrees with you. She also said that this delta variant is going to create more long haulers than the other variants because of how easily it's transmitted and how aggressively it attaches itself in your nose and throat right when you catch it. She said that vaccinated people who catch it most likely won't have long hauler issues from it because it isn't nearly as aggressive when you catch it and the symptoms don't last long enough or get bad enough to cause the long term damage that it does to an unvaccinated person. I couldn't be happier with Orleans Parish forcing people to prove vaccination or a negative test no older than 72 hours to pretty much go anywhere or do anything indoors. 75% of Orleans Parish residents have at least gotten their first shot already. People coming to Orleans from other parishes and states can stay away if they refuse to protect those of us who chose to protect them. (Too bad they're the ones filling up all of the hospitals in Orleans Parish.) BTW...if you have the LA Wallet app for your driver's license, it can import your vaccination records from the state health department so you don't have to worry about carrying the card around with you.

superchuck500 said:

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superchuck500 said:

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Good! That said, I suspect DeSantis will simply ignore the letter.

So true.