Community Assignment: The Agenda of the [Opposing View] (1 Viewer)

[V Chip]

From the Other Site's thread started by what I called a shirt grenade... I thought maybe we could try an assignment here, if people are up to it.

Instead of creating a caricature of what people think the opposing view wants, why not try an actual thoughtful representation of what each side thinks the other wants. Would we be willing to discuss and come up with a real concise idea of what the other side wants in regard to certain issues? If we use that disingenuous post as a start, we would have a few issues to try and come up with what the liberals feel is what the conservatives really want regarding immigration/border policy, law enforcement, opposition to the other side's leaders (Trump for example, or Pelosi/Obama/AOC/whoever), and maybe add one or two other issues that were left out in that post -- and obviously what conservatives feel about liberals views as well.

So the assignment would be to go to the private boards and start a discussion there, trying to come up with real versions of what the other side wants. Once the discussions have taken place on the private boards, someone would come back here and post up the Conservative take on what Liberals want, and the Liberal take on what Conservatives want. Once here, the actual liberals and conservatives would be able to critique the posts and offer feedback on what is good and what isn't, and maybe that can offer a starting point for better discussions.

The Moderates -- well, either you can watch and comment once the final posts are done, or you can have double duty and offer your ideas on what Conservatives and Liberals want.

Does anyone think this would be worthwhile, or would we be pissing into a partisan wind?

 

[TheRealTruth]

Think this is pretty good idea and would be interested to see the results.

 

[BobE]

V I actually kind of like this idea

 

[cuddlemonkey]

I think this is a terrific thought exercise.

 

[JRad]

It’s like a debate but not a debate but may be a debate. Like it.

 

[Intensesaint]

Good idea Vchip, I already started a discussion on the conservative board about an issue. Hope it takes off.

 

[Beach Friends]

Let me see if I understand correctly.

Each side is going to try to "steelman" the other side's position. In other words, as a conservative, I would try my best to state the progressive position in a way that progressives would agree with.


Or,

Are we trying to delve into what we think the other side "really" wants? (Which sounds like it would get into strawmanning real fast and I think would get into a shirtshow).

 

[LA - L.A.]

Let me see if I understand correctly.

Each side is going to try to "steelman" the other side's position. In other words, as a conservative, I would try my best to state the progressive position in a way that progressives would agree with.


Or,

Are we trying to delve into what we think the other side "really" wants? (Which sounds like it would get into strawmanning real fast and I think would get into a shirtshow).

How you choose to approach it and what you choose to do are entirely up to you.

 

[Beach Friends]

How you choose to approach it and what you choose to do are entirely up to you.

I think we should at least have a common understanding of what the goal is.

 

[LA - L.A.]

I think we should at least have a common understanding of what the goal is.

Instead of creating a caricature of what people think the opposing view wants, why not try an actual thoughtful representation of what each side thinks the other wants.

So the assignment would be to go to the private boards and start a discussion there, trying to come up with real versions of what the other side wants.

Seems clear to me that the poster wants a sincere and honest assessment of what liberals honestly and sincerely think conservatives really want, and vice versa.

There's nothing honest or sincere about "strawmanning" anyone. It's clear that the poster is trying go get everyone to try to honestly see and understand the beliefs and goals of people with opposing views.

 

[Lazybones]

Let me be more specific. If we are discussing immigration, do those on the left want us to say what we think the actual motivation is for immigration? I’m just asking for clarification.

Would it be a better exercise to list the things that we believe about immigration? Instead of projecting what others think, we can clarify what our motives are about a list of issues. Just my 2 cents.

 

[Dragon]

Let me be more specific. If we are discussing immigration, do those on the left want us to say what we think the actual motivation is for immigration? I’m just asking for clarification.

Would it be a better exercise to list the things that we believe about immigration? Instead of projecting what others think, we can clarify what our motives are about a list of issues. Just my 2 cents.

I don't think that it what the OP wanted. He wanted each group to try to describe the "other" sides oppinion without creating a caricature of what people think the opposing view wants. So no smacktalk and no "strawmanning" - just dealing in actual topics and oppinions.

 

[Lazybones]

I don't think that it what the OP wanted. He wanted each group to try to describe the "other" sides oppinion without creating a caricature of what people think the opposing view wants. So no smacktalk and no "strawmanning" - just dealing in actual topics and oppinions.

I don’t know if that is possible, but I will participate and observe.

 

[Dragon]

I don’t know if that is possible, but I will participate and observe.

Isn't that basically up to us? we are all adults and if we show mutual respect and NOT do those things then it would probably help bring us closer to the way Andrus wanted this place to be

 

[crosswatt]

Just FYI, the debate board was created for this very exercise in the future. Once we go live, one idea was to have a weekly topic/issue announced ahead of time and consensus arguments decided in the conservative/moderate/progressive boards, then discussed fully inside the debate thread. This made me think of it, so I thought to put it out there for a reminder for future instances.

 

[JimEverett]

Its what good arguments entail: If you find you disagree with a position, you state that position in the strongest, best possible way and then point out why it is wrong.

 

[Lazybones]

Isn't that basically up to us? we are all adults and if we show mutual respect and NOT do those things then it would probably help bring us closer to the way Andrus wanted this place to be

I’m with you, but it will be hard on both sides. If I really say why I think that the left is in favor of immigration, it will be met with ridicule. Now I could make up a reason for the sake of conversation, but at the end of the day what does that really do?

 

[cuddlemonkey]

I’m with you, but it will be hard on both sides. If I really say why I think that the left is in favor of immigration, it will be met with ridicule. Now I could make up a reason for the sake of conversation, but at the end of the day what does that really do?

If you discuss it with people on the conservative board and everyone agrees that what you think is the legitimate reason liberals support a specific position, you can put it forth for debate and actual liberals can show you why you are either right or wrong. The aim is to educate, not ridicule.