United States vs. Venezuela

[superchuck500]

For some time now, the US has been concentrating naval forces (with Marine detachments) in the Caribbean and general vicinity of Venezuela. Observers have expected some kind of operation there but what that would be wasn't clear. In the past days, the USA's high-profile destruction of an alleged Venezuelan narcotics vessel (including Rubio's explanation that the vessel - not carrying any sort of flag and operated by assumed civilians - was destroyed and its 11 occupants instead of arrested based on orders directly from Trump because it "was an immediate danger to the United States") appears to be setting up some kind of pretext for additional action, a Venezuelan 'Gulf of Tonkin incident' if you will. Trump has indeed promised that this is the beginning of a campaign.

Critics have pointed that the US military's action against the vessel likely violated both international law and well-established US policy. Others have said it is likely that the vessel had migrants and not narcotics. And of course with Trump and his henchmen, the given explanation (combating drug trafficking) is never the actual reason - it's always something more directly tied to Trump's ego and thirst for accolades and retribution.

From a post last week on the buildup:

U.S. Navy Destroyers, Submarine, Amphibious Ships Being Sent Toward Venezuela

The White House calls Venezuelan ruler Maduro a "narco-terrorist" and is deploying ships, planes and Marines in a major show of force.

www.twz.com

Analysis on the legal implications of the destruction of the vessel and its 11 occupants.

Legal Issues Raised by a Lethal U.S. Military Attack in the Caribbean

The Trump administration’s extraordinary lethal attack on this purported smuggling vessel raises significant potential legal issues.

www.justsecurity.org

 

[brandon]

weather is crap rn in that area. Plus it will take several days for the strike group to get there.

But yes, this is going to get dicey in the next week or two.

And while Venezuela has no real up-to-date armament, they have some and it only takes one ADA shot to take down an aircraft.

I suspect it will be mostly cruise missile type strikes, and those air launched, well outside the range of their AA missiles.

I cannot imagine a scenario where we actually look to land troops- the coastline isnt conducive for that type of operation - and landing too far east ( Where shoreline is better suited ) is loooong way away from target.

Oh yea, I'm not saying right now. It took a long time for the Russian buildup to actual escalate to invasion. We're still very much in the early phase.

But we're on the same track.

 

[MT15]

 

[MT15]

Just the fact that we cannot dismiss this out of hand is bad news.

 

[MT15]

 

[LA 2 L.A.]

doesnt matter what they were told in "intel" - Duty to Deny is a directive that every US service man/woman has to deny an order THEY know to be illegal. Doesnt matter what the intel says nor commanding officer, if they know it to be illegal they must deny.

Being given false intel creating a false legal justification to follow an order without knowing the intel and legal justification are false would mean they did not know the order was illegal.

All I'm saying is that some people may have been genuinely tricked into carrying out orders they believed in good faith were legal. Trump, his intelligence chiefs, his security chiefs, and Hegseth would all give false intel to military personnel without hesitation.

 

[LA 2 L.A.]

I think pulling the carrier group out of the Mediterranean shows this is coming from Putin more than Trump. If we start pulling more forces from the European theater to redeploy them to South America, that's about creating an opening for Putin to expand his invasion into other European countries.

 

[superchuck500]

 

[efil4]

Venezuela will defend itself.

And i have to think the strikes would be cruise missile launches from well outside any ADA range but you never know.

This is nuts.

 

[efil4]

 

[brandon]

Venezuelan airstrikes on deck.

Literally.

This guy literally predicts the future every single time.

 

[efil4]

This guy literally predicts the future every single time.

needed that Cat5 Melissa out the way....and a few Generals lol

 

[efil4]

NOTAM issued by DoD thru FAA ( Notice To Air Men )

We did this back in April for Diego Garcia in Indian Ocean when Iran strikes were imminent.

 

[efil4]

AF2 on way south. Hmmm...

 

[Dragon]

Why do republican presidents always want to start a war..... The world wants to know

 

[superchuck500]

This might be the answer to why now- the war powers authorization expires Nov 3.

Expert Backgrounder on War Powers Resolution 60-Day Clock for Boat Strikes Expiring Monday

Expert backgrounder on how War Powers Resolution works in application to U.S. military operations against suspected drug cartels.

www.justsecurity.org

 

[efil4]

This might be the answer to why now- the war powers authorization expires Nov 3.

Expert Backgrounder on War Powers Resolution 60-Day Clock for Boat Strikes Expiring Monday

Expert backgrounder on how War Powers Resolution works in application to U.S. military operations against suspected drug cartels.

www.justsecurity.org

I can appreciate the article as its quite informative.

But i dont think this Administration gives a damn about "keeping within the rules". ( of the 60 day expiration from date of notice to Congress )

And with the lack of backbone in Congress, they will simply defer to POTUS.

 

[Maxp]

There is no point on bombing Venezuela and leaving Maduro alive. The guy is a complete Peice of work that all of South America hates. I'm thinking this is more of a "back off Guyana" tactic more than anything else. Communist Venezuela "nationalized" Exxon's oil fields and now they are trying to do the same in Guyana. They probably need a few missiles thrown their way.

 

[efil4]

There is no point on bombing Venezuela and leaving Maduro alive. The guy is a complete Peice of work that all of South America hates. I'm thinking this is more of a "back off Guyana" tactic more than anything else. Communist Venezuela "nationalized" Exxon's oil fields and now they are trying to do the same in Guyana. They probably need a few missiles thrown their way.

Under what current US/International law?