Increasing racist attacks on Asians (2 Viewers)

Farb · Feb 24, 2021

https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/2021/02/09/attacks-asian-american-elderly-/

I will admit, I didn't know anything about these these strings of attacks and the murder of elderly Asian American out west. Really disturbing. In most cases, they have caught sub human scum that have committed these crimes.
In the case of the murder of Ratanapakdee, I sincerely hope the death penalty will be sought, although that is not possible in the state of CA.

cuddlemonkey · May 6, 2021

Farb said:
No where have I stated that. Remember, I think the laws are great just the way they are.....

I apologize they way I post upsets you. I think the best course would be not to reply to me, no?
I disagree with your posts and don't find anything worth discussing in most of them, so I don't engage with your condescending 'coaching' posts and chose to ignore your sincere help on what to digest with regards to news and information and how to better phrase and fit in more with your opinions.

I thought you were a little more intuitive but I do hope I did a better job explaining why I don't engage with some on this board. No offense of course.

Do you believe that intent matters at all when it comes to sentencing? For example, the maximum federal sentence for first-degree murder is life in prison while the maximum sentence for involuntary manslaughter is six years. Do you think this is acceptable?

DaveXA · May 6, 2021

brandon said:
This is why we can’t have nice things.

Yeah, I just throw my hands up and say, ok whatever. Meh.

not2rich · May 7, 2021

Farb said:
I think hate crimes are stupid. I think they are a device for activists and politicians to virtue signal, a dog whistle as the the radicals leftys like to say, to the stupid ones among us, and sadly they believe it is a good thing while in fact, it is just a separate form of basic racism.

If person decides to kill a person because they are white, then that is 1st degree murder. If a person decides to kill a person because they are black, then that is also 1st degree murder but now you sprinkle in a 'hate' crime? Why is one more severe?

1st Degree murder is 1st degree murder. I still don't understand why it matters what race, sex or religion the victim and criminal are. Manslaughter is manslaughter. Two very different crimes with only death of the victim being relatable.

So the slaughter of 6 million people by the Nazis was no different than any other murders, but for efficiency and quantity? By your logic, the murders of black people by klansmen in the Jim Crow south was no different than "black on black" murders in present day Chicago. Do you really think there is no distinction between the two?

Farb · May 7, 2021

not2rich said:
So the slaughter of 6 million people by the Nazis was no different than any other murders, but for efficiency and quantity? By your logic, the murders of black people by klansmen in the Jim Crow south was no different than "black on black" murders in present day Chicago. Do you really think there is no distinction between the two?

We have a name for that crime..genocide. See?

Farb · May 7, 2021

cuddlemonkey said:
Do you believe that intent matters at all when it comes to sentencing? For example, the maximum federal sentence for first-degree murder is life in prison while the maximum sentence for involuntary manslaughter is six years. Do you think this is acceptable?

I am not going to keep going and back and explaining what I already explained. Yes. That is acceptable. There is intent in crime that factors into the punishment.

If you have a different sentences because of the pigmentation of the victims skin, then that is where I have a problem.

Farb · May 7, 2021

DaveXA said:
Yeah, I just throw my hands up and say, ok whatever. Meh.

I feel your pain on this board, I really do.

One thing I have learned is to just ignore people that make you raise your hands and say Meh. Honestly, you might find some peace in that. It is worth a shot.

Optimus Prime · May 7, 2021

Farb said:
I think hate crimes are stupid. I think they are a device for activists and politicians to virtue signal, a dog whistle as the the radicals leftys like to say, to the stupid ones among us, and sadly they believe it is a good thing while in fact, it is just a separate form of basic racism.

If person decides to kill a person because they are white, then that is 1st degree murder. If a person decides to kill a person because they are black, then that is also 1st degree murder but now you sprinkle in a 'hate' crime? Why is one more severe?

No hate crime here

brandon · May 7, 2021

Farb said:
If you have a different sentences because of the pigmentation of the victims skin, then that is where I have a problem.

Goes to intent, your honor.

Optimus Prime · May 7, 2021

Farb said:
If you have a different sentences because of the pigmentation of the victims skin, then that is where I have a problem.
Farb said:
If people are not hired because of the pigmentation of their skin, then that is where I have a problem.
Farb said:
If people are disciplined more because of the pigmentation of their skin, then that is where I have a problem.
Farb said:
If people are fired more often because of the pigmentation of their skin, then that is where I have a problem.
Farb said:
If people are denied bank loans because of the pigmentation of their skin, then that is where I have a problem.
Farb said:
If employees are ruder or ignore customers because of the pigmentation of their skin, then that is where I have a problem.
Click to expand...
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Do you have a problem with all of these scenarios as well?

Farb said:
If you have a different sentences because of the pigmentation of the victims skin, then that is where I have a problem.

But since you have a problem with different sentences based on race you must have a huge problem with this:
=============================

STUART — Chase Legleitner was 19 when he robbed three men in a 2008 drug deal.

Lamar Lloyd was 21 when he stuck up a Pizza Hut and gas station the following year.

Both men pleaded no contest to two counts of armed robbery. They went before the same judge, in the same courthouse. Each had a single misdemeanor on his record. They tallied the exact same points on the scoresheets used to determine criminal punishments in Florida.

But their sentences could not have been more different.

Legleitner spent less than two years in county jail. He is now free to golf and fish on the weekends.

Lloyd got 26 years in prison. He will be 47 upon his release in 2034.

That disparity is not unusual in the courtroom of Judge Sherwood “Chip” Bauer Jr.

Since taking the bench a decade ago, Bauer has been tougher on those with a darker complexion, often sentencing blacks to two or three times longer than white defendants who committed the same crimes........

To his peers, Bauer embodies all of the qualities desired in a judge.

But records show that since joining the bench, he has sentenced blacks convicted of robbery to more than triple the time of whites who committed the same crimes under similar circumstances.

That equates to nearly five extra years in prison.

“How do you sleep at night when you do something like that?” said Rev. Jerry Gore, president of the NAACP of Martin County. “When you go to the jail or the courthouse and start talking about African-American problems, they say, ‘Nobody gets treated like that. That doesn’t happen. We don’t behave like that.’ But these things actually do happen.”

“If an African-American robs a Circle K and a Caucasian robs a Circle K, the African-American is getting more time. We know it’s a problem here. But who are you going to talk to? Where do you go?”............

In the cases of Janine Sheehan and Rethema Delancy, both women were charged with felony drug crimes. Both tallied 28.4 points on their sentencing scoresheets, indicating they should receive matching punishments. Both went before Bauer.

The judge gave Sheehan, a white woman, six months in county jail.

Delancy, who is black, got 18 months in prison.

Terrance Berry and Edward Mueller each scored 32.6 points for felony drug charges. Bauer gave Berry — a black man — two years in state prison. He let Mueller — the white defendant — walk with probation.

Convicted of felony driving with a suspended license, Matthew Way and Cornelius Roberson had identical points at sentencing. Bauer sentenced Roberson —the black man — to almost double the time.

Bauer also gives more second chances to those who look like him.

First-time offenders and those the court finds unlikely to re-offend can earn a fresh start through a process called adjudication withheld. This removes the label of “convicted felon” from a defendant’s record.

That discretion lies with the judge, and for those in Bauer’s courtroom, the reprieve is slanted..............

‘We all think we’re fair.’

Does implicit bias explain why blacks are sentenced to more jail time than whites in Florida? Read Bias on the Bench, Sarasota Herald-Tribune’s exhaustive investigation of Florida’s broken sentencing system.

projects.heraldtribune.com

==================================

This article is about a single judge in Florida but this is happening in courtrooms all across the country and has for over a century

Farb · May 7, 2021

Optimus Prime said:
Do you have a problem with all of these scenarios as well?

But since you have a problem with different sentences based on race you must have a huge problem with this:
=============================

STUART — Chase Legleitner was 19 when he robbed three men in a 2008 drug deal.

Lamar Lloyd was 21 when he stuck up a Pizza Hut and gas station the following year.

Both men pleaded no contest to two counts of armed robbery. They went before the same judge, in the same courthouse. Each had a single misdemeanor on his record. They tallied the exact same points on the scoresheets used to determine criminal punishments in Florida.

But their sentences could not have been more different.

Legleitner spent less than two years in county jail. He is now free to golf and fish on the weekends.

Lloyd got 26 years in prison. He will be 47 upon his release in 2034.

That disparity is not unusual in the courtroom of Judge Sherwood “Chip” Bauer Jr.

Since taking the bench a decade ago, Bauer has been tougher on those with a darker complexion, often sentencing blacks to two or three times longer than white defendants who committed the same crimes........

To his peers, Bauer embodies all of the qualities desired in a judge.

But records show that since joining the bench, he has sentenced blacks convicted of robbery to more than triple the time of whites who committed the same crimes under similar circumstances.

That equates to nearly five extra years in prison.

“How do you sleep at night when you do something like that?” said Rev. Jerry Gore, president of the NAACP of Martin County. “When you go to the jail or the courthouse and start talking about African-American problems, they say, ‘Nobody gets treated like that. That doesn’t happen. We don’t behave like that.’ But these things actually do happen.”

“If an African-American robs a Circle K and a Caucasian robs a Circle K, the African-American is getting more time. We know it’s a problem here. But who are you going to talk to? Where do you go?”............

In the cases of Janine Sheehan and Rethema Delancy, both women were charged with felony drug crimes. Both tallied 28.4 points on their sentencing scoresheets, indicating they should receive matching punishments. Both went before Bauer.

The judge gave Sheehan, a white woman, six months in county jail.

Delancy, who is black, got 18 months in prison.

Terrance Berry and Edward Mueller each scored 32.6 points for felony drug charges. Bauer gave Berry — a black man — two years in state prison. He let Mueller — the white defendant — walk with probation.

Convicted of felony driving with a suspended license, Matthew Way and Cornelius Roberson had identical points at sentencing. Bauer sentenced Roberson —the black man — to almost double the time.

Bauer also gives more second chances to those who look like him.

First-time offenders and those the court finds unlikely to re-offend can earn a fresh start through a process called adjudication withheld. This removes the label of “convicted felon” from a defendant’s record.

That discretion lies with the judge, and for those in Bauer’s courtroom, the reprieve is slanted..............

‘We all think we’re fair.’
Does implicit bias explain why blacks are sentenced to more jail time than whites in Florida? Read Bias on the Bench, Sarasota Herald-Tribune’s exhaustive investigation of Florida’s broken sentencing system.
projects.heraldtribune.com
==================================

This article is about a single judge in Florida but this is happening in courtrooms all across the country and has for over a century

So, is this systemic or is Bauer a bad judge?
At least this was an example that happened when most of us were alive.

Does Florida sentencing guidelines take into account past criminal history and attitude and presentation in the court? I honestly have no idea.

brandon · May 7, 2021

Farb said:
At least this was an example that happened when most of us were alive.

Most of us?

Is anyone here under the age of 13?

Also, VOTER ID LAWS. YOU WERE TOLD ABOUT VOTER ID LAWS. VOTER ID LAWS ARE AN EXAMPLE OF SYSTEMIC RACISM HAPPENING RIGHT NOW.

Optimus Prime · May 7, 2021

Farb said:
So, is this systemic or is Bauer a bad judge?

Most definitely systematic

I also have no doubt that once released it's harder for black ex-convicts to find jobs and housing
===================

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2017/11/16/black-men-sentenced-to-more-time-for-committing-the-exact-same-crime-as-a-white-person-study-finds/

Racial Disparity in Sentencing

The history of racial disparity in the criminal justice system in the U.S. have been longstanding. The racial dynamics in sentencing have changed over time and reflect a move from explicit racism to more surreptitious manifestations and outcomes....

www.opensocietyfoundations.org

The Growing Racial Disparity in Prison Time

A new study finds black people are staying longer in state prisons, even as they face fewer arrests and prison admissions overall.

www.themarshallproject.org

People Of Color Receive The Harshest Punishments, And The Disparities Are Growing

Racial disparities in incarceration rates are dropping but still remain high. Racial disparities in sentence lengths are growing.

theappeal.org

Same Crime, More Time

Research by criminal justice professor William Sabol reveals that racial disparities in the U.S. prison population have declined, but Blacks are still serving longer sentences than whites.

news.gsu.edu

cuddlemonkey · May 7, 2021

Farb said:
I am not going to keep going and back and explaining what I already explained. Yes. That is acceptable. There is intent in crime that factors into the punishment.

If you have a different sentences because of the pigmentation of the victims skin, then that is where I have a problem.

So if a person intends to do harm to someone based on the color of their skin, they should face a more strict sentence. Right?

Farb · May 8, 2021

cuddlemonkey said:
So if a person intends to do harm to someone based on the color of their skin, they should face a more strict sentence. Right?

No

Farb · May 8, 2021

Optimus Prime said:
Most definitely systematic

I also have no doubt that once released it's harder for black ex-convicts to find jobs and housing
===================

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2017/11/16/black-men-sentenced-to-more-time-for-committing-the-exact-same-crime-as-a-white-person-study-finds/

Racial Disparity in Sentencing
The history of racial disparity in the criminal justice system in the U.S. have been longstanding. The racial dynamics in sentencing have changed over time and reflect a move from explicit racism to more surreptitious manifestations and outcomes....
www.opensocietyfoundations.org

The Growing Racial Disparity in Prison Time
A new study finds black people are staying longer in state prisons, even as they face fewer arrests and prison admissions overall.
www.themarshallproject.org

People Of Color Receive The Harshest Punishments, And The Disparities Are Growing
Racial disparities in incarceration rates are dropping but still remain high. Racial disparities in sentence lengths are growing.
theappeal.org

Same Crime, More Time
Research by criminal justice professor William Sabol reveals that racial disparities in the U.S. prison population have declined, but Blacks are still serving longer sentences than whites.
news.gsu.edu

If is most definitely, then there is proof. Actual proof, not subjective proof, but yet I cannot find any concrete proof for a HUGE problem that I have been told is in every institution and what this country was founded on. To me, it sounds more like backfilling a preconceived hypothesis.

brandon · May 8, 2021

cuddlemonkey said:
Do you believe that intent matters at all when it comes to sentencing?

Farb said:
Yes. That is acceptable. There is intent in crime that factors into the punishment.

cuddlemonkey said:
So if a person intends to do harm to someone based on the color of their skin, they should face a more strict sentence. Right?

Farb said:
No

This is why we can't have nice things.

Optimus Prime · May 8, 2021

Farb said:
If is most definitely, then there is proof. Actual proof, not subjective proof, but yet I cannot find any concrete proof for a HUGE problem that I have been told is in every institution and what this country was founded on. To me, it sounds more like backfilling a preconceived hypothesis.

It seems to me that comparing the sentences of white vs blacks for the exact same crime in the same jurisdiction with the same exact judge would be proof enough
and it seems those scenarios playing out nationwide would be proof enough

What would be "actual proof" to you? I'm genuinely curious

Do you want to judge to actually say in court "you're getting a longer sentence because your black"?

What would it have to take for you to say "that definitely and only happened because he/she/they were Asian/black/gay"

cuddlemonkey · May 8, 2021

Farb said:
No

And you realize how this is completely incongruent with your previous statement, as illustrated by Brandon?

Increasing racist attacks on Asians (2 Viewers)

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