Federal Law Enforcement Use Unmarked Vehicles To Grab Protesters Off Portland Streets (UPDATE: Trump admin. deploying federal LE to cities) (1 Viewer)

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    Dragon

    Dragon

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    “All United States Marshals Service arrestees have public records of arrest documenting their charges. Our agency did not arrest or detain Mark James Pettibone.”

    OPB sent DHS an extensive list of questions about Pettibone’s arrest including: What is the legal justification for making arrests away from federal property? What is the legal justification for searching people who are not participating in criminal activity? Why are federal officers using civilian vehicles and taking people away in them? Are the arrests federal officers make legal under the constitution? If so, how?

    After 7 p.m. Thursday, a DHS spokesperson responded, on background, that they could confirm Wolf was in Portland during the day. The spokesperson didn’t acknowledge the remaining questions.
    Click to expand...



    www.opb.org

    Federal Law Enforcement Use Unmarked Vehicles To Grab Protesters Off Portland Streets

    Federal law enforcement officers have been using unmarked vehicles to drive around downtown Portland and detain protesters since at least July 14.
    www.opb.org





    This story is very troublesome.
     
    Farb said:
    1

    If one signs up for the job of a 'wall' during a protest, you kind of know what you are walking into correct?
    Click to expand...

    AFAIK they don't break any laws being a wall, therefore if the Feds attack them with gas and batons, the feds are the ones breaking not only the law but the oath they took when they got their job.
     
    https://www.fox5ny.com/news/shootings-up-130-in-new-york-city

    "
    NEW YORK - Police statistics show that murders in New York City are up 23% in the first 6 months of 2020 versus the same period in 2019. There were 181 murders in the first six months compared to 147 the previous year.

    Shootings were up 130% for the month of June, according to the NYPD. In June there were 205 shooting incidents in New York City compared to only 89 in June 2019. The number of shootings rose in every borough, according to NYPD officials.


    Along with shootings and murders, burglaries were up 118% and auto thefts were up more than 50%.

    The NYPD blames two things for the spike, bail reform, which quickly puts criminals back on the streets and directing police resources to react to a wave of protests that have taken place across the city for the past month.


    "The sharp increase in shootings and violence in New York puts innocent people at risk and tears at the fabric of life in our city," NYPD Police Commissioner Dermot Shea said in a statement.

    https://www.cbsnews.com/news/chicago-gun-violence-56-shot-this-weekend-four-killed/

    That was a few weeks ago. Add in last night in Chicago, that goes up by 14 people. I am going out on a limb and say the cause would be the BLM riots.
     
    They've been trying to burn the federal courthouse down for while now. That would seem to me to be breaking the law.
     
    JLL said:
    They've been trying to burn the federal courthouse down for while now. That would seem to me to be breaking the law.
    Click to expand...

    I think they should leave the Fed courthouse alone. Demonstrate in front of it. Protest. That’s fine. I don’t understand the need to burn or tear down the protective barriers and such. That’s the insistence I don’t understand. Assuming it’s happening as reported
     
    Farb said:
    https://www.fox5ny.com/news/shootings-up-130-in-new-york-city

    "
    NEW YORK - Police statistics show that murders in New York City are up 23% in the first 6 months of 2020 versus the same period in 2019. There were 181 murders in the first six months compared to 147 the previous year.

    Shootings were up 130% for the month of June, according to the NYPD. In June there were 205 shooting incidents in New York City compared to only 89 in June 2019. The number of shootings rose in every borough, according to NYPD officials.


    Along with shootings and murders, burglaries were up 118% and auto thefts were up more than 50%.

    The NYPD blames two things for the spike, bail reform, which quickly puts criminals back on the streets and directing police resources to react to a wave of protests that have taken place across the city for the past month.


    "The sharp increase in shootings and violence in New York puts innocent people at risk and tears at the fabric of life in our city," NYPD Police Commissioner Dermot Shea said in a statement.

    https://www.cbsnews.com/news/chicago-gun-violence-56-shot-this-weekend-four-killed/

    That was a few weeks ago. Add in last night in Chicago, that goes up by 14 people. I am going out on a limb and say the cause would be the BLM riots.
    Click to expand...


    Did you even read what you just quoted? No where does it say that the protesters were doing the crimes, but rather that criminals took advantage of the fact that the police was busy monitoring people using their lawfull right to protest.
     
    And as usual Trump is using fake images to rouse his followers


    • President Donald Trump's reelection campaign released a new Facebook ad with an image of a group of protesters attacking a police officer alongside the words "public safety vs chaos & violence."
      [*]But that photo is actually from a pro-democracy protest in Kyiv, Ukraine, in 2014. The photographer, Mstyslav Chernov, confirmed to Business Insider that it is his photo from six years ago.
      Click to expand...


    https://www.businessinsider.com/tru...tacked-2014-ukraine-protests-2020-7?r=US&IR=T
     
    Dragon said:
    AFAIK they don't break any laws being a wall, therefore if the Feds attack them with gas and batons, the feds are the ones breaking not only the law but the oath they took when they got their job.
    Click to expand...
    I will even concede the point that maybe the police did break the law for this point. (I don't believe they did and think its laughable)
    If those behind the wall break the law, what then? You signed up to be a wall, to literally place yourself between two groups that might break the law. What do you think will happen? Because your a 'mom' or a woman you get some special treatment. Nope, you get the gas, baton, frozen water bottles to the back of head, rocks ect.... you signed up to be a wall.
     
    Dragon said:
    Did you even read what you just quoted? No where does it say that the protesters were doing the crimes, but rather that criminals took advantage of the fact that the police was busy monitoring people using their lawfull right to protest.
    Click to expand...
    Try the part I highlighted.
     
    Ayo said:
    I think they should leave the Fed courthouse alone. Demonstrate in front of it. Protest. That’s fine. I don’t understand the need to burn or tear down the protective barriers and such. That’s the insistence I don’t understand. Assuming it’s happening as reported
    Click to expand...
    I could not agree more. If it was protesting, I am 100% behind it (unless you block roads during a work day, that will turn me against your cause).
    Americans should love a good peaceful protest. If it gets violent or destructive, spare us all the shocked faces when you are met by violence in return.
     
    Farb said:
    I will even concede the point that maybe the police did break the law for this point. (I don't believe they did and think its laughable)
    If those behind the wall break the law, what then? You signed up to be a wall, to literally place yourself between two groups that might break the law. What do you think will happen? Because your a 'mom' or a woman you get some special treatment. Nope, you get the gas baton, frozen water bottles to the back of head, rocks ect.... you signed up to be a wall.
    Click to expand...


    So in your book it is ok for the police to violently attack people who use their constitutional right to peacefully protest just because they're in the way? and attack without giving them time to move away as described earlier? The only group attacking those women was the one who was supposed to defend their rights
     
    Farb said:
    Try the part I highlighted.
    Click to expand...

    You just highlighted that the total amount of crime rose, but as the article stated there was multiple reasons for that, and nowhere does it says that those protesters were the ones doing the crimes
     
    The protests last night were peaceful just like every other night.

    the tear gas comes when they come out of the building (in hiding) at like 1230, beat people and fire off tear gas and grenades for about 40 minutes and go back in for the night. That happens after the speakers are done and before 1am. This happens every night.

    then the city is left to deal with it after they go back inside like cowards.

    these protests are sanctioned and approved by the city council. They have permits to be there. The feds do not.
     
    Farb said:
    I will even concede the point that maybe the police did break the law for this point. (I don't believe they did and think its laughable)
    If those behind the wall break the law, what then? You signed up to be a wall, to literally place yourself between two groups that might break the law. What do you think will happen? Because your a 'mom' or a woman you get some special treatment. Nope, you get the gas, baton, frozen water bottles to the back of head, rocks ect.... you signed up to be a wall.
    Click to expand...

    The feds have definitely violated civil rights and, from the word of lawyers I have read, are criminally liable for their actions. Did you read the thread that I posted which looks at the instance described by both the acting DHS secretary and the under secretary? They are in so far over their heads they didn’t know their own explanation for one occurrence described an illegal act. Here is another lawyer, no liberal for sure, advising those Feds to go carefully and watch what they do. They need to protect themselves because this administration is hanging them out to dry by encouraging them to break the law.

     
    Farb said:
    https://www.fox5ny.com/news/shootings-up-130-in-new-york-city

    "
    NEW YORK - Police statistics show that murders in New York City are up 23% in the first 6 months of 2020 versus the same period in 2019. There were 181 murders in the first six months compared to 147 the previous year.

    Shootings were up 130% for the month of June, according to the NYPD. In June there were 205 shooting incidents in New York City compared to only 89 in June 2019. The number of shootings rose in every borough, according to NYPD officials.


    Along with shootings and murders, burglaries were up 118% and auto thefts were up more than 50%.

    The NYPD blames two things for the spike, bail reform, which quickly puts criminals back on the streets and directing police resources to react to a wave of protests that have taken place across the city for the past month.


    "The sharp increase in shootings and violence in New York puts innocent people at risk and tears at the fabric of life in our city," NYPD Police Commissioner Dermot Shea said in a statement.

    https://www.cbsnews.com/news/chicago-gun-violence-56-shot-this-weekend-four-killed/

    That was a few weeks ago. Add in last night in Chicago, that goes up by 14 people. I am going out on a limb and say the cause would be the BLM riots.
    Click to expand...

    So this is a good post and provides some context about the crime statistics, the police even give two causes, which both seem at least somewhat plausible. More information is needed, but it’s a start.

    Then you betray your bias with your last sentence. There have been no “BLM riots” as such. There have been a whole lot of peaceful BLM protests. BLM as an organization isn’t causing the riots and to say such is false and inflammatory, IMO.
     
    MT15 said:
    So this is a good post and provides some context about the crime statistics, the police even give two causes, which both seem at least somewhat plausible. More information is needed, but it’s a start.

    Then you betray your bias with your last sentence. There have been no “BLM riots” as such. There have been a whole lot of peaceful BLM protests. BLM as an organization isn’t causing the riots and to say such is false and inflammatory, IMO.
    Click to expand...


    He also conveniently left out this part


    According to recent crime statistics released to CBS Chicago, 1,229 people have been shot in Chicago, about 100 fewer than the first six months of 2018, and the lowest total since 2015. Police also said there have been 236 murders through the end of June, 21 fewer than the same time period last year.
    Click to expand...
     
    The increase in NYC is also suspect from a statistical POV, to me, since it involves only six months which is a fairly small sample size. Let’s see how the second half of the year goes before we peddle the nonsense that these cities are suddenly somehow unlivable and that is all the fault of BLM.

    here is a table of major crimes in NYC since 2000 (from NYPD). Murders are about 1/2 of what they were in 2000 even with the slight uptick last year. As I said before, anyone who thinks this is all about violent crime is being fooled.

    790FD1F4-7A9B-42C8-A4EF-24E6CFC59BC3.jpeg
     
    MT15 said:
    So this is a good post and provides some context about the crime statistics, the police even give two causes, which both seem at least somewhat plausible. More information is needed, but it’s a start.

    Then you betray your bias with your last sentence. There have been no “BLM riots” as such. There have been a whole lot of peaceful BLM protests. BLM as an organization isn’t causing the riots and to say such is false and inflammatory, IMO.
    Click to expand...
    I dont think I betrayed my bias. I am bias. I am very very bias. We are all bias. We have all been on this board. We know each others bias. To pretend otherwise is silly.
     

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