Trump’s decision on Syria (1 Viewer)

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    MT15

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    I heard a lot of talk this morning on this seemingly abrupt decision. I heard worry that Turkey will roll into Syria and massacre the Kurds who have been one of our most loyal allies in the region. Lindsey Graham isn’t a big fan, and I think when Trump flirted with this decision before is when Jim Mattis resigned, but I may be misremembering that.

    What I have not heard is why Trump is doing this now, when he was dissuaded before. What has changed to cause us to abandon the Kurds to an oppressive regime that is certainly capable of rolling in there to slaughter them? Graham seems more concerned that this gives ISIS a new boost.


    "This impulsive decision by the President has undone all the gains we've made, thrown the region into further chaos. Iran is licking their chops. And if I'm an ISIS fighter I've got a second lease on life. So to those who think ISIS has been defeated you will soon see," Graham said during an interview on Fox News' "Fox and Friends."

    "I hope I'm making myself clear how shortsighted and irresponsible this decision is in my view," the South Carolina Republican added.

    Graham, a supporter of the President who has at times previously split with him publicly, said, "I like President Trump. I've tried to help him. This to me is just unnerving to its core to say to the American people, 'ISIS has been destroyed in Syria' -- (that) is not true."
     
    I remember Iran being involved and it was around the time that the Good Hope refinery exploded. I went back and looked and that was 1981. The Iran/Iraq war seems to have just started. But no I don’t remember the details as I was 8ish

    And who was deeply involved in that war?
     
    Common sentiment. What is it you think they are policing, and why?


    Not really, as long as a coherent plan is presented and carried out.

    Honestly I am a bit in shock right now because you seem to be in agreement with the Republicans in congress.
     
    I’m not smart enough to understand that part of the country. As a young man, I want to say around 1986, the world news was on. They were showing people fighting in the Middle East. I asked my father why were they fighting.

    He said, “lazybones those people have been fighting for as long as I remember I’m my lifetime. They will be fighting during your entire lifetime.”

    Smart man

    Today unfortunately the world has become so small that it is important to understand history and why something happens.
    This is no longer a far away place - this is less than a days travel from your front door and mine as well. What happens there will eventually affect both yours and my communities in one way or another.

    It will also affect the degress by which US troops will be able to get local help when deployed somewhere - if the US leaders can't be trusted to keep the promises made - then this will have longterm and serious consequences
     
    Honestly I am a bit in shock right now because you seem to be in agreement with the Republicans in congress.

    It’s not just the Republicans in Congress, it’s pretty much across the board. Pat Robertson had some harsh words for this action, for crying out loud. Trump has really messed this up.

    From reports on tv this morning, he made this decision after being on a call with Erdogan without consulting his national security advisors, the State Department, or his military advisors. Of course he tweeted that he consulted “everyone” but he lies easily and often.

    Even people who support the general goal of getting US forces out of the ME agree that this isn’t the place to start and this isn’t the way to do it. It’s a huge concession to Erdogan with nothing extracted in return that we know about.

    So it’s pretty much everyone in agreement that this was a rash, nonsensical and wrong-headed action taken in haste by someone who should be better prepared for his job.
     
    "I have a little conflict of interest 'cause I have a major, major building in Istanbul," Trump said in December 2015. "It's a tremendously successful job. It's called Trump Towers—two towers, instead of one, not the usual one, it’s two."


    So, at best, he's withdrawing due to a conflict of interest between the nation and his wallet. At worst, he's following direction from the other interested party in the area (Russia). I really would love to hear anyone provide a reason for this action that doesn't support either a gross violation of the Emoluments Clause or pure capitulation to a foreign entity.
     
    They were showing people fighting in the Middle East. I asked my father why were they fighting.

    He said, “lazybones those people have been fighting for as long as I remember I’m my lifetime. They will be fighting during your entire lifetime.”
    A sentiment also expressed in the 1930s and '40s with regard to Europe.

    That something has been true to a large extent does not mean it will be true to the same extent. Fatalism makes poor grounds for decision making.

    That aside, we could debate a policy of isolationism or minimal intervention, but that's not what this is. This is selective disengagement on the pretext of non-intervention. Even if the disengagement is justified, which is highly debatable, it's being handled incredibly badly with what are likely to be pretty dire consequences.
     
    I've been holding back on commenting, as I wanted more information. On the surface - great, we're getting some troops home! But this is the worst possible execution. Which, coincidentally, seems to be what we're exposing our ally to. When so many of Trump's mouthpieces in Congress are even saying this was a terrible move, I think that tells you all you need to know.

    We shouldn't be turning our back on allies who have had ours. Maybe someone with military experience can better speak to this, but if the US and Kurd forces have been fighting so closely together, isn't there enough of that brotherhood there to want to stay and help?
     
    Some details on Trump's conflict of interest in Turkey. Apparently, Trump already caved once due to financial pressure from Turkey when he was implementing the muslim travel ban and Turkey objected. He is totally compromised.

     
    Yes, and the immediate scheduling of a WH visit for Erdogan today just looks bad. The optics are terrible.
     
    Yes, and the immediate scheduling of a WH visit for Erdogan today just looks bad. The optics are terrible.
    To who? Until conservative elected officials and voters start to push back on his unacceptable actions, this guy is going to keep acting in his own personal financial interests unencumbered.
     
    Well, I guess it looks bad to all people who aren’t all-in for Trump? It’s getting to be a larger number all the time. 👍🏻
     
    To who? Until conservative elected officials and voters start to push back on his unacceptable actions, this guy is going to keep acting in his own personal financial interests unencumbered.

    Push back? I think his support among his base has never been stronger. - I know a lot of people who are like me, they either didn't support him at all or only reluctantly pulled the lever for him in 2016 but now are definitely in his corner.
     

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